Do you have an open mind?

Astro wrote: And when i say higher power i mean like a thiest someone who believes in a god just not a certain one

What do you mean by god?

Cid wrote: You flame religions and its followers without even considering their side of the story. You’re not much different from Hitler with his extermination of the jews

Ummm by god i mean someone who is much greater than us humans who is in control of everything

A genius isnt someone with a massive amount of intellegence, a genius is someone who shoots at something no one else can see and hits it.

And i c u say that used to be ur reason interesting. did u ever make a wrong choice following the holy spirit or what u thought was the holy spirit

A genius isnt someone with a massive amount of intellegence, a genius is someone who shoots at something no one else can see and hits it.

Astro wrote: Ummm by god i mean someone who is much greater than us humans who is in control of everything

That would include aliens, if we were in the matrix and if this was a dream and your subconscious was controlling everything that was happening.

Cid wrote: You flame religions and its followers without even considering their side of the story. You’re not much different from Hitler with his extermination of the jews

Ummm how do u kno aliens are greater than humans?

A genius isnt someone with a massive amount of intellegence, a genius is someone who shoots at something no one else can see and hits it.

Astro wrote: And i c u say that used to be ur reason interesting. did u ever make a wrong choice following the holy spirit or what u thought was the holy spirit

You mean my subconscious. Yes. I have learned that it cannot be trusted on matters on moral grounds. You must think about morals before acting on them.

Cid wrote: You flame religions and its followers without even considering their side of the story. You’re not much different from Hitler with his extermination of the jews

Astro wrote: Ummm how do u kno aliens are greater than humans?

How do you know “god” is greater then humans?

Cid wrote: You flame religions and its followers without even considering their side of the story. You’re not much different from Hitler with his extermination of the jews

Lol because my defenition of god is someone who is greater than humans so if hes not greater than humans i dont believe its god.

A genius isnt someone with a massive amount of intellegence, a genius is someone who shoots at something no one else can see and hits it.

Astro wrote: Lol because my defenition of god is someone who is greater than humans so if hes not greater than humans i dont believe its god.

So why can’t aliens be greater than humans? Does this include the sun? The galaxy? The universe?

Cid wrote: You flame religions and its followers without even considering their side of the story. You’re not much different from Hitler with his extermination of the jews

Gplex wrote:

Astro wrote: Lol because my defenition of god is someone who is greater than humans so if hes not greater than humans i dont believe its god.

So why can’t aliens be greater than humans? Does this include the sun? The galaxy? The universe?

No because at the end of my defention i said someone who controls everything

A genius isnt someone with a massive amount of intellegence, a genius is someone who shoots at something no one else can see and hits it.

Gplex wrote: I am telling you not to add words to my quotes. Do I actually have to explain how adding words to peoples quotes is dishonest?

Setting the record straight:
[quote=Gplex Demon Soul (a.k.a., lying, manipulative, smartass piece of shit)]But I will conceived [concede? / am willing to conceive?] that someday, a Christian (or religious person [and/or “idiot” ? ]) will surprise me.

Gosh golly you’re right, thanks for bringing me to my senses. Until now, I didn’t see what a deceitful douche bag I was being back there, misrepresenting your statement like I did, and especially how childish and arrogant I was to assume no one would notice, after having actually 'read' your unaltered post on the very same page, right above mine, or would’ve acknowledged that you wouldn’t be confused about what you yourself wrote. That was completely inconsiderate of me and inappropriate, I must apologize.

Gplex wrote: If you keep this troll like behavior up, I will stop replying to you.

If I’d had much of a passion for “trolling”, I might have gone on repeatedly, deliberately misquoting you making retarded remarks about yourself, to invoke a negative emotional reaction out of you.

Demon Soul wrote: Bla bla bla, too many words for such a sort question.

My original wording:

Demon Soul wrote: What is the desired outcome of discussing this?

Apparently, that wasn’t sufficient.

Gplex wrote: You want to claim I’m a emotional wreck?

I really don’t think you are an “emotional wreck”. I trust you can control your emotions, as such is warranted in this type of discussion.

By “emotions are interfering”, I’m referring to a fear of looking stupid or inferior, that comes as a sort of paranoia, when a person has poised themselves as socially “superior” in some way, at the expense of others' supposed social worth or validity.

It’s obvious by the demeaning words you use to degrade or invalidate others, that you’re seeking and defending a personal sense of pride in your intellectual prowess and methods of understanding things. That pride centered psychology can easily lend itself to leanings and biases that inevitably jeopardize one’s ability to fully integrate all angles and aspects of a matter, before forming conclusions.

Gplex wrote: I already told everyone here my motives. I’m searching for the truth!

Somehow, I’ve managed to miss where you’d previously stated that...

Granted, you did imply that recognizing 'truth' is very important to you, even perhaps a life goal, but in terms of the respective end goal of your original post and topic, the genuine hope to personally obtain a more complete sense of truth is not easily drawn from your attitude, and what you’ve said.

From there, it was left to conjecture.

Gplex wrote: I have had a few people telling me I need to have an open mind. This video explains why this statement is bs

This tends to lead one to assume that you’re either wanting others to accept and respect your methods of discerning truth, or seeking their personal 'approval' of those methods, or simply wanting to help other people understand 'reality' better.

None of these natural deductions infer a personal desire to find an expanded sense of truth from anyone else’s experience or insight.

If “searching for truth” is honestly, all you’re hoping to accomplish here, then I should say, it “looks” much more as though you’re after a sense of 'moral superiority' over foolishly sentimental, stubbornly proud, and hypocritical people.

Respecting, caring for, and valuing “idiots” is actually, a quite “open minded” and 'rationally logical' behavior. That is, considering that, said “idiots” often respond favorably to being genuinely valued and appreciated, even if just for their unyielded potential to contribute to a fuller collective understanding of the life we share.

Most of us, whether we consider ourselves to be “idiots” or not, started out as what we would now deem, 'stubborn idiots'. If we now consider ourselves to be more “important” and “valuable” members of society, then equal potential value can be seen in those who’ve not yet become trusting or “open minded” enough to “rise above their fearful cling to idiocy”.

Gplex wrote:
Jumping to conclusions before knowing the facts is closed minded.
No, I made the assertion that all Christians I have run into are closed minded; this has been reinforced after I started talking to Christians from other countries.
After experiencing this I am confident that every Christian is closed minded. Just as I am confident that there are no unicorns – you can’t prove that! You want to know why? Because they jump to conclusions! Their entire belief system relies on them being closed minded. I already told you that I am willing to accept the possibility that there maybe Christians out there that are not closed minded.

Yet you will act like they are until proven otherwise. What then? Are you still going to treat Christians as if they are closed-minded? And how can you assume that the Christians you’ve met are always closed-minded? From my experiences with you, I think it fair to assume you probably called their beliefs stupid and they got upset, and in anger exhibited closed-minded behavior.

And to say that their entire belief system is based on being closed-minded is completely bullshit. Not once have I blocked out any new information, and I’m a Christian. My Christian family hasn’t and my Christian friends haven’t either. Even then, I don’t automatically assume that any new Christians I meet will be closed-minded or open-minded, I’ll let them prove that themselves and even then, I need substantial time to know them before I can say that is a part of their character.

Gplex wrote: So you are claiming that because I can process an argument faster than you, that I am closed minded?
It seems like the word is flat, that doesn’t make it so.

No I am not, I only stated that closed-minded people would probably have the tendency to come to conclusions faster. I didn’t even mention my own ability to analyze someone’s argument, which could be faster than yours; I don’t know and neither do you.

Gplex wrote: Act? When do I act upon them? I have already told you, I have trained myself you use logic and reasoning when presented with a argument or/and evidence. I do not jump to snap decisions I think before I say something.

King Boo’s quotes and your conclusion based upon them is a perfect example of this. And, wow, I’ve also been trained to use logic and rational reason. Everyone that has taken English 101 and 102 in America is trained for that, since it’s the main focus of the classes.

Gplex wrote: You wanted to call me closed minded, but pointing out that king boo was closed minded. I find you willingness to be dishonest distasteful.

Strawman again. And I’m not being dishonest, you’re just confused or something.

You obviously can’t analyze very well if you think that’s what I’ve been doing. Let me requote you AGAIN (for like, the 3rd or 4th time? I forget):

Gplex wrote:

King Boo wrote: I have an open mind.

....

King Boo wrote: Even doesn’t exists, evil is just the absence of God.

Clearly you dont.

Let’s break this down:

You are quoting King Boo’s claim that he has an open mind. You then quote him again showing one of his statements, and then claim he clearly does not have an open mind. I assume that with those two quotes, you believe that believing in God automatically makes someone closed-minded.

It cannot be judged solely by that one statement that he is closed-minded. Believing in God is not closed-minded. I say again, I don’t block out information, I receive it, and I still believe in God. I don’t block out evolution, I don’t block out the Big Bang, I don’t block out anything (well, I try not to, I’m not perfect). It is an invalid argument because it is simply not true. A Christian may be closed-minded, but so can a Bhuddist or an atheist or a libertarian. It has more to do with the person’s character than what they believe in, such as how prideful they are or how much they’ve been reinforced to think they are always right.

Gplex wrote: If every person I spar with from one club, always likes to lead off with a jab, and I expect it every time is that prejudice? I would think it stupid of me to not to expect nothing else.

No, because prejudice is related to a group of people, not one person. If that one person always jabs at you, then it is completely rational to expect it. He/she is one person. Prejudice is using a group of people to determine how one person is. You can find patterns, yes, but you aren’t a sociologist, so I doubt you’ve actually done research.

EDIT: I misread the quote, you were talking about a group of people after all. That is prejudice, but it isn’t necessarily wrong. The smaller the group, the more accurate your expectations are going to be. But don’t assume all Christians are closed-minded, and I frankly don’t give a flying shit what your experiences are. It’s wrong to assume things about a group of people, especially when it’s based just upon you, and not any extensive data.

You have preconceived notions about Christians and/or believing in God. You act upon these too, as demonstrated with King Boo. You are closed-minded in this respect. Quit saying you aren’t.

Gplex wrote:
All of these I am willing to admit, might not happen. – But in my experience it is unlikely.
Without assumptions like these, I could not operate in the real world.
Christianity is a belief system that relies on a person being closed mined. I don’t understand why you do not understand this simple concept.

When you assume someone is closed-minded because of their beliefs and not because of what they exhibit, then you are closed-minded.

And Christianity does not rely on that. Again, I believe in God, yet I don’t have to be closed-minded to do so. I don’t know why you think that.

Haruhi demands you join Anime United!

RageOverdose wrote: ..I believe in God, yet I don’t have to be closed-minded to do so. I don’t know why you think that.

One would assume, because you have no 'material' evidence of the existence of the God you accept, and “supposedly” much “evidence” of the contrary.

RageOverdose wrote: A Christian may be closed-minded, but so can a Bhuddist or an atheist or a libertarian. It has more to do with the persons character than what they believe in, such as how prideful they are or how much theyve been reinforced to think they are always right.

What people believe is often intertwined with their personality type. Of course, you can’t say things like “All Muslims are agressive” because there are a billion Muslims around the world with radically different outlooks on life as well as varied interpretations of their own religion, but each belief someone has entails a certain type of thought process that lead them to hold that belief.

Muslims and Christians in the modern world often do not truly follow the teachings of their religious books, leading to extremely varied beliefs and thus extremely varied personalities, but among some (who, in my opinion interpret it truthfully) such as Osama Bin Laden, you do find patterns in personality that are undeniable. Extreme close mindedness, intolerance, unquestionable loyalty and a lack of empathy are all characteristic of people who have an extreme belief in religious or political authority and sense of “The ends justify the means”. In the same sense, among Jehovah’s Witnesses who are also a closely knit group of believers, you see strong personality patterns emerge such as a fear of breaking rules and trying to be nice to everyone. LaVeyan Satanists who are less closely knit but usually embrace “an eye for an eye” and “indulge yourself” mentality would probably be types who would feel less guilty in selfishness or more vengeful when wronged than say, someone who follows a kind of Ghandi-style pacifist movement.

What I’m trying to say is, the closer you follow a belief, the closer it will have certain tie-ins with how you think and act. Christians are a broad group, but because they have some things in common, obviously there will be some patterns present. And though some take non-literal interpretations of Genesis or whatever, in the end what they have is a belief that God exists and that Jesus was God or the Son of God. That is a belief there is no physical evidence or solid logical reasoning for, so as a group, it would not be over generalizing to say they are either not skeptical, thinking wishfully or ignorant of the facts when it comes to religion.

Muslims and Christians in the modern world often do not truly follow the teachings of their religious books, leading to extremely varied beliefs

Very true. In fact, Catholicism here in the Philippines now confuses me. We (Filipino) Catholics believe that Genesis is symbolism (we even consider God turning sands to a person symbolizing evolution itself) and we know we have more freedom than any other Christians. But when I look at Catholicism in other countries like US, their Catholicism seem different compared to ours. They take Genesis literally, and they’re more close-minded than us.

So, in short, yes I have an open mind. An open-minded Catholic, so to speak.

Astro wrote:

Gplex wrote:

Astro wrote: Lol because my defenition of god is someone who is greater than humans so if hes not greater than humans i dont believe its god.

So why can’t aliens be greater than humans? Does this include the sun? The galaxy? The universe?

No because at the end of my defention i said someone who controls everything

Who says they don’t control everything.

Demon Soul wrote: Gosh golly you’re right, thanks for bringing me to my senses. Until now, I didn’t see what a deceitful douche bag I was being back there, misrepresenting your statement like I did, and especially how childish and arrogant I was to assume no one would notice, after having actually 'read' your unaltered post on the very same page, right above mine, or would’ve acknowledged that you wouldn’t be confused about what you yourself wrote. That was completely inconsiderate of me and inappropriate, I must apologize.

Unlike you I won’t add words to your sarcastic quote.

Demon Soul wrote: If I’d had much of a passion for “trolling”, I might have gone on repeatedly, deliberately misquoting you making retarded remarks about yourself, to invoke a negative emotional reaction out of you.

Or you could have shaped up and behaved for a little while so you could keep trolling me in the future.

Demon Soul wrote: Apparently, that wasn’t sufficient.

I remember a lot more to your reply then just that.

Demon Soul wrote: I really don’t think you are an “emotional wreck”. I trust you can control your emotions, as such is warranted in this type of discussion.

That’s not what you said earlier.

Demon Soul wrote: By “emotions are interfering”, I’m referring to a fear of looking stupid or inferior, that comes as a sort of paranoia, when a person has poised themselves as socially “superior” in some way, at the expense of others' supposed social worth or validity.

There is no way I could have got all that from only “emotions are interfering”.

Demon Soul wrote: It’s obvious by the demeaning words you use to degrade or invalidate others, that you’re seeking and defending a personal sense of pride in your intellectual prowess and methods of understanding things. That pride centered psychology can easily lend itself to leanings and biases that inevitably jeopardize one’s ability to fully integrate all angles and aspects of a matter, before forming conclusions.

I seek to defend the truth.

Demon Soul wrote: Somehow, I’ve managed to miss where you’d previously stated that...

Maybe you are too new.

Demon Soul wrote: Granted, you did imply that recognizing 'truth' is very important to you, even perhaps a life goal, but in terms of the respective end goal of your original post and topic, the genuine hope to personally obtain a more complete sense of truth is not easily drawn from your attitude, and what you’ve said.

Roll eyes.

Demon Soul wrote: From there, it was left to conjecture.

Yes.

Demon Soul wrote: This tends to lead one to assume that you’re either wanting others to accept and respect your methods of discerning truth, or seeking their personal 'approval' of those methods, or simply wanting to help other people understand 'reality' better.

I want people to rely more on facts, then beliefs – it would make for a much safer planet.

Demon Soul wrote: None of these natural deductions infer a personal desire to find an expanded sense of truth from anyone else’s experience or insight.

Maybe. I do catch myself sometimes doing such things, but I always correct it when I do notice these desires. It’s not something you can completely get rid of - at least I think I can’t.

Demon Soul wrote: If “searching for truth” is honestly, all you’re hoping to accomplish here, then I should say, it “looks” much more as though you’re after a sense of 'moral superiority' over foolishly sentimental, stubbornly proud, and hypocritical people.

Considering I use to be one of them no.

Demon Soul wrote: Respecting, caring for, and valuing “idiots” is actually, a quite “open minded”

I would like to see your logic for this.

Demon Soul wrote: and 'rationally logical' behavior. That is, considering that, said “idiots” often respond favorably to being genuinely valued and appreciated, even if just for their unyielded potential to contribute to a fuller collective understanding of the life we share.

So now you are suggesting that I would treat “idiots” as if they are human?

Demon Soul wrote: Most of us, whether we consider ourselves to be “idiots” or not, started out as what we would now deem, 'stubborn idiots'. If we now consider ourselves to be more “important” and “valuable” members of society, then equal potential value can be seen in those who’ve not yet become trusting or “open minded” enough to “rise above their fearful cling to idiocy”.

If you do not believe yourself to be more important than everyone else, why do you not kill yourself and donate your organs? I am not ashamed to say that I value my life, more then someone else’s.

Your post is well set up and has very few spelling errors. So I suspect you have written a lot of essays in your time?
You have replied the exact way you did in your last post. You make a lot of claims about me, but refuse to back it up with evidence. I know I said I wouldn’t respond to you if you did this again, but for some reason I find you entertaining.

RageOverdose wrote: Yet you will act like they are until proven otherwise. What then? Are you still going to treat Christians as if they are closed-minded? And how can you assume that the Christians you’ve met are always closed-minded? From my experiences with you, I think it fair to assume you probably called their beliefs stupid and they got upset, and in anger exhibited closed-minded behavior.

I would call all those who assumed before it was proven correct that it was correct closed minded.
I didn’t mean that. I meant that every Christian that has ever presented an argument for Christianity towards me was closed mined.
I believe do expect that every argument I get form a Christian for Christianity will be stupid. I’m sorry I just don’t have any other reason to expect anything else. Of course I will continue to pay attention, because I am willing to admit I could be wrong.
LOL. Yes you may be right. I did notice that their logic was fairy… dodgy, and made it quite clear why I believe so, and yes, usually they get upset that I think that their great argument is stupid.

RageOverdose wrote: And to say that their entire belief system is based on being closed-minded is completely bullshit. Not once have I blocked out any new information, and I’m a Christian. My Christian family hasn’t and my Christian friends haven’t either. Even then, I don’t automatically assume that any new Christians I meet will be closed-minded or open-minded, I’ll let them prove that themselves and even then, I need substantial time to know them before I can say that is a part of their character.

Have you ever assumed that your god did something without evidence? Isn’t that what Christianity is base around? I maybe mistaken.

RageOverdose wrote: No I am not, I only stated that closed-minded people would probably have the tendency to come to conclusions faster. I didn’t even mention my own ability to analyze someone’s argument, which could be faster than yours; I don’t know and neither do you.

I was thinking back to the time when you quoted me saying I instantly thought someone’s argument was stupid. – I may have looked too much into that.

RageOverdose wrote: King Boo’s quotes and your conclusion based upon them is a perfect example of this. And, wow, I’ve also been trained to use logic and rational reason. Everyone that has taken English 101 and 102 in America is trained for that, since it’s the main focus of the classes.

Umm alright….

RageOverdose wrote: Strawman again. And I’m not being dishonest, you’re just confused or something.
You obviously can’t analyze very well if you think that’s what I’ve been doing. Let me requote you AGAIN (for like, the 3rd or 4th time? I forget):

He is quoting me! – That doesn’t sound right.

RageOverdose wrote: Let’s break this down:
You are quoting King Boo’s claim that he has an open mind. You then quote him again showing one of his statements, and then claim he clearly does not have an open mind. I assume that with those two quotes, you believe that believing in God automatically makes someone closed-minded.

Is that a question? I take it as one. Attributing something to a god without evidence is closed minded.

RageOverdose wrote: It cannot be judged solely by that one statement that he is closed-minded. Believing in God is not closed-minded. I say again, I don’t block out information, I receive it, and I still believe in God. I don’t block out evolution, I don’t block out the Big Bang, I don’t block out anything (well, I try not to, I’m not perfect). It is an invalid argument because it is simply not true. A Christian may be closed-minded, but so can a Bhuddist or an atheist or a libertarian. It has more to do with the person’s character than what they believe in, such as how prideful they are or how much they’ve been reinforced to think they are always right.

That is true, but king boo has said things to me along these lines before. Which is the entire reason why I commented on his post.
You do not understand the meaning of a closed mind.

RageOverdose wrote: No, because prejudice is related to a group of people, not one person. If that one person always jabs at you, then it is completely rational to expect it. He/she is one person. Prejudice is using a group of people to determine how one person is. You can find patterns, yes, but you aren’t a sociologist, so I doubt you’ve actually done research.

So your rebuttal is “nah ah”?
Is it wrong for me to recognize patterns?

RageOverdose wrote: EDIT: I misread the quote, you were talking about a group of people after all. That is prejudice, but it isn’t necessarily wrong. The smaller the group, the more accurate your expectations are going to be. But don’t assume all Christians are closed-minded, and I frankly don’t give a flying shit what your experiences are. It’s wrong to assume things about a group of people, especially when it’s based just upon you, and not any extensive data.

I’m a pattern seeking machine, all humans are. I already told you my expectations of a group of people are not locked in that one configuration.

RageOverdose wrote: You have preconceived notions about Christians and/or believing in God. You act upon these too, as demonstrated with King Boo. You are closed-minded in this respect. Quit saying you aren’t.

Belief in god, and attributing something to that god without evidence is 2 totally different things. I have shown you what feels like 10 times why king boos assumptions is closed minded.

RageOverdose wrote: When you assume someone is closed-minded because of their beliefs and not because of what they exhibit, then you are closed-minded.

Christians attribute things to a god. HELLO!!!!!!

RageOverdose wrote: And Christianity does not rely on that. Again, I believe in God, yet I don’t have to be closed-minded to do so. I don’t know why you think that.

I sure you have figure out why I can assume Christians are closed minded.

Super long post! Super long post! Super long post!

Cid wrote: You flame religions and its followers without even considering their side of the story. You’re not much different from Hitler with his extermination of the jews

You make my point very well, thanks.

Demon Soul wrote: You make my point very well, thanks.

What was your point again? I didn’t catch it through all the accusations?

Cid wrote: You flame religions and its followers without even considering their side of the story. You’re not much different from Hitler with his extermination of the jews

Gplex wrote: What was your point again? I didn’t catch it through all the accusations?

I forget (< — obvious retarded lie), but most likely, just more of the same old baseless and irrelevant presumptions I keep finding myself ignorantly throwing around, like would be expected from the usual idiot.

Never the less, an idiot can learn a lot through others' experience, 'if' its efforts aren’t compulsively distracted by constant social climbing attempts; a type of “climbing” that, of course, has more to do with 'shoving others down', than actually moving oneself 'upwards'.

Gplex wrote: I seek to defend the truth.

Gplex wrote: I want people to rely more on facts, then beliefs - it would make for a much safer planet.

Cool, thanks.
Glad you want to help people (No offense intended by the way, I’m not trying to imply you care about them, but either way, thanks still, because it makes a better world for all of us).

Gplex wrote: If you do not believe yourself to be more important than everyone else, why do you not kill yourself and donate your organs?

1. Maybe you don’t need to actually believe or consider yourself to be “more important” than someone, in order to be jealous enough of their perceived “importance”, to sacrifice them in order to relieve your own feelings of envy.

Some find the most 'attractive' solution to the haunting pangs of envy, is to simply make the 'other' person suffer severe enough loss and/or pains (including humiliation) that they can no longer envy said 'other' person.
-But yes, underlying all that, could still be some stray inner sense of 'self-entitlement', indicating some kind of belief of 'personal superiority'.

2. A fatal submission of one’s human flesh could presumably entail caring 'more' for another, as opposed to 'equally'. This would be especially true if one would not ever accept such an offering from another.

3. An extended lifespan may not actually be the most valuable offering one could make, if the “quality over quantity” principle applies to the potential recipient’s value set. There may actually be other things the dying individual would find more touching or “life enriching”, that one could offer by staying embodied.

___


My point in regard to respecting/valuing/caring for others, in light of 'potential' mutual interests, however, was that by conducting sociologically healthy and constructive relations, even with those who you might at that time deem to be “idiots”, can often end up quite rewarding, educationally.

Gplex wrote: I suspect you have written a lot of essays in your time?

No. I can see no effective way of explaining my literacy/lack of, in any credible way.

SO MANY QUOTES I DONT WANNA KEEP UP WITH THIS LOL and Gplex do u believe there are aliens greater than us and control everything dont u believe in Physical Evidence and Reasoned Logic

A genius isnt someone with a massive amount of intellegence, a genius is someone who shoots at something no one else can see and hits it.