The Afterlife.. Is there more?

Cid wrote: Bah, these pointless arguments are going no where. Have fun in believing in nothing dude.

I will

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alright the clans are back!!!! Lets revive the game section!

bugsbunny wrote: yeah i believe there is a God and you ram, dont, thats the bottom line.

Well that’s why I made this thread. To see if anyone can meet the challenge.

Anyway it’s getting late, I’m going to bed. Nite all.

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bugsbunny isn’t really using that great of arguments

well its ur choice

alright the clans are back!!!! Lets revive the game section!

i chose to believe in the god of theology who rewards good and punished evil and i no longer believe in that god

ramunematt wrote:

bugsbunny wrote:

ramunematt wrote:

bugsbunny wrote:

ramunematt wrote:

bugsbunny wrote:

ramunematt wrote:

bugsbunny wrote: And because we chose evil, God wont allow sin into heaven so he is giving us a chance to get rid of sin on this earth.

Why doesn’t he get rid of the sin himself? That seems like a much easier plan.

and He did by sending His Son to die on the cross.

So then why do we still have so much sin in the world? Why are we still born with original sin? And why sacrifice someone to forgive the sins? Couldn’t he just have forgiven us?

Listen again, we are born with sin because of Adam and Eve eating the apple from the tree that God commanded not to. He sacrificed His Son to save us.

But why sacrifice his son to save us? If he is all powerful then he should have just forgiven them without the trouble of sending down Jesus to die.

Also, does Jesus dieing for our sins also mean Adam and Eve’s (and by extension our own sins) were also forgiven?

He sent his son to save us so that we can live eternal life.

That doesn’t answer my question.

The whole point of the sacrifice was that Jesus was both a martyr and a savior. But instead of just forgiving everyone, God chose to give people the ability to make choices. The sacrifice was meant to be an indicator to what God wanted people to believe, yet at the same time, God didn’t want to MAKE people believe. He wanted true believers that came to believe by their own free will. And yes, God DOES know who will believe and who won’t. All those who will be permitted into heaven have their name in the Book of Life.

That doesn’t mean that the future is predetermined. The way I see it (by the way, I don’t have typical views of Christianity. Some may say my beliefs are contradictory. I say, “If you don’t like it, tough shit, you don’t have to." God knows what choices we will be presented with, and what each choice will result in and that it goes in a chain like that. However, I also think that He CHOOSES not to simply predetermine each individual’s fate. He certainly has the power, being omnipotent. However, it doesn’t necessarily mean he uses that power.

So by giving people free will, he still knows what will happen, but it’s not because that’s what he makes happen. He simply knows, despite the fact that it is a choice that hasn’t happened yet and he didn’t influence. Not making sense? Read on.

Another thing you need to keep in mind is that you’re trying to remain within the confines of logic. The problem is, being omnipotent, God literally has the power to do ANYTHING, including anything which may defy logic.

So for example, you may say that, logically, if God knows how our lives will play out, you might say He didn’t give us free will. However, being omnipotent, God is capable of making both true.

Another one, the “Can God ask himself a question he doesn’t know the answer to?"

The answer is both yes and no. He can both know the answer, and yet at the same time, not know the answer. Seems illogical right? Well in comes omnipotence. This omnipotence literally means he has no limitations. He can do absolutely, positively anything, including defy logic.


You have to understand, omnipotence isn’t something that can truly be completely grasped by one who is not willing to understand that this is bypassing every limitation, law, rule, etc.

alias wrote: bugsbunny isn’t really using that great of arguments

I was sucking pretty bad too wasn’t I? lol

Rise of Shinra

Cid wrote:

alias wrote: bugsbunny isn’t really using that great of arguments

I was sucking pretty bad too wasn’t I? lol

I dunno, I think I did fairly well getting my point across, unless matt has his head up his ass.

Maggot Face wrote:

Cid wrote:

alias wrote: bugsbunny isn’t really using that great of arguments

I was sucking pretty bad too wasn’t I? lol

I dunno, I think I did fairly well getting my point across, unless matt has his head up his ass.

Matt is my friend and all here... but I have to say... he’s pretty hard headed. I’ve never seen him back down from anything religious related... Even when I think he’s clearly been outdone.

No offense Matt, just an observation.

Rise of Shinra

Cid wrote:

Maggot Face wrote:

Cid wrote:

alias wrote: bugsbunny isn’t really using that great of arguments

I was sucking pretty bad too wasn’t I? lol

I dunno, I think I did fairly well getting my point across, unless matt has his head up his ass.

Matt is my friend and all here... but I have to say... he’s pretty hard headed. I’ve never seen him back down from anything religious related... Even when I think he’s clearly been outdone.

No offense Matt, just an observation.

No what I mean is if he refuses to even consider that it may be possible that he’s wrong (which he doesn’t seem to. I’ve never seen him admit to being wrong. And I guarantee you he’s not always right.) or that someone else arguing something other than what he thinks may have a point.


Also, he really is thinking to much within limits.




And Cid, did you read my post? I’m actually rather interested in what people have to think of it, especially since I spent 20 minutes typing it up.

Maggot Face wrote:

Cid wrote:

Maggot Face wrote:

Cid wrote:

alias wrote: bugsbunny isn’t really using that great of arguments

I was sucking pretty bad too wasn’t I? lol

I dunno, I think I did fairly well getting my point across, unless matt has his head up his ass.

Matt is my friend and all here... but I have to say... he’s pretty hard headed. I’ve never seen him back down from anything religious related... Even when I think he’s clearly been outdone.

No offense Matt, just an observation.

No what I mean is if he refuses to even consider that it may be possible that he’s wrong (which he doesn’t seem to. I’ve never seen him admit to being wrong. And I guarantee you he’s not always right.) or that someone else arguing something other than what he thinks may have a point.


Also, he really is thinking to much within limits.




And Cid, did you read my post? I’m actually rather interested in what people have to think of it, especially since I spent 20 minutes typing it up.

That’s basically what I meant about not backing down. >_>

And I didn’t read it... big paragraphs scare me.

Rise of Shinra

Cid wrote:

Maggot Face wrote:

Cid wrote:

Maggot Face wrote:

Cid wrote:

alias wrote: bugsbunny isn’t really using that great of arguments

I was sucking pretty bad too wasn’t I? lol

I dunno, I think I did fairly well getting my point across, unless matt has his head up his ass.

Matt is my friend and all here... but I have to say... he’s pretty hard headed. I’ve never seen him back down from anything religious related... Even when I think he’s clearly been outdone.

No offense Matt, just an observation.

No what I mean is if he refuses to even consider that it may be possible that he’s wrong (which he doesn’t seem to. I’ve never seen him admit to being wrong. And I guarantee you he’s not always right.) or that someone else arguing something other than what he thinks may have a point.


Also, he really is thinking to much within limits.




And Cid, did you read my post? I’m actually rather interested in what people have to think of it, especially since I spent 20 minutes typing it up.

That’s basically what I meant about not backing down. >_>

And I didn’t read it... big paragraphs scare me.

lol, I meant in general.

Ach, come on, read it. I want to at least know if it makes sense to someone other than the one who wrote it down.

God literally has the power to do ANYTHING, including anything which may defy logic.

That line would make any person shut up if they were actually open to views. Good job Maggot, you’ve done something that I failed at. Explained the limitations of God’s power, which is none.

Rise of Shinra

hey ram, jus curious, why dont u believe in god?

Cid wrote: God literally has the power to do ANYTHING, including anything which may defy logic.

That line would make any person shut up if they were actually open to views. Good job Maggot, you’ve done something that I failed at. Explained the limitations of God’s power, which is none.

Whoo!

God doesn’t have to make sense to our feeble human minds, He’s God! 8D

Maggot Face wrote:

Cid wrote: God literally has the power to do ANYTHING, including anything which may defy logic.

That line would make any person shut up if they were actually open to views. Good job Maggot, you’ve done something that I failed at. Explained the limitations of God’s power, which is none.

Whoo!

God doesn’t have to make sense to our feeble human minds, He’s God! 8D

Pretty much. We can’t understand perfection because we’re imperfect.

Rise of Shinra

Cid wrote:

Maggot Face wrote:

Cid wrote: God literally has the power to do ANYTHING, including anything which may defy logic.

That line would make any person shut up if they were actually open to views. Good job Maggot, you’ve done something that I failed at. Explained the limitations of God’s power, which is none.

Whoo!

God doesn’t have to make sense to our feeble human minds, He’s God! 8D

Pretty much. We can’t understand perfection because we’re imperfect.

Quite so.

Well I’ve explained enough non-contradicting contradictions for one night. I’m off to sleeps.

Maggot Face wrote:

Cid wrote:

Maggot Face wrote:

Cid wrote: God literally has the power to do ANYTHING, including anything which may defy logic.

That line would make any person shut up if they were actually open to views. Good job Maggot, you’ve done something that I failed at. Explained the limitations of God’s power, which is none.

Whoo!

God doesn’t have to make sense to our feeble human minds, He’s God! 8D

Pretty much. We can’t understand perfection because we’re imperfect.

Quite so.

Well I’ve explained enough non-contradicting contradictions for one night. I’m off to sleeps.

Good night dude.

Rise of Shinra

Cid wrote:

Maggot Face wrote:

Cid wrote:

alias wrote: bugsbunny isn’t really using that great of arguments

I was sucking pretty bad too wasn’t I? lol

I dunno, I think I did fairly well getting my point across, unless matt has his head up his ass.

Matt is my friend and all here... but I have to say... he’s pretty hard headed. I’ve never seen him back down from anything religious related... Even when I think he’s clearly been outdone.

No offense Matt, just an observation.

No offense taken. But think about it, it’s not easy trying to see the religious side when you’ve grown out of it. Just like how it’s hard to believe in the tooth fairy or Santa after you’ve outgrown them.

And Maggot, I’ll get to your paragraphs later. I have to go to school in a few minutes so I don’t have time to reply to it at the moment.

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