Cid wrote:
God literally has the power to do ANYTHING, including anything which may defy logic.
That line would make any person shut up if they were actually open to views. Good job Maggot, you’ve done something that I failed at. Explained the limitations of God’s power, which is none.
Haha, if I had a dollar for every time I’ve heard that one. I’m just going to post Dawkins’s explanation for this one since I have to leave in a few minutes.
The actual answer to your question isn’t until about 4:20.
Last Enemy wrote:
hey ram, jus curious, why dont u believe in god?
Wow, I could answer this in so many ways. I’ll answer it in two ways:
1. I couldn’t get past the whole talking snake thing
2. Why don’t you believe in Zeus? Why don’t you believe in Thor? Why don’t you believe in the celestial teapot or the flying spaghetti monster or any of the other gods of the hundreds of other religions? I could answer this question right now but first I want to see what your answer is.
bugsbunny wrote:
And because we chose evil, God wont allow sin into heaven so he is giving us a chance to get rid of sin on this earth.
Why doesn’t he get rid of the sin himself? That seems like a much easier plan.
and He did by sending His Son to die on the cross.
So then why do we still have so much sin in the world? Why are we still born with original sin? And why sacrifice someone to forgive the sins? Couldn’t he just have forgiven us?
Listen again, we are born with sin because of Adam and Eve eating the apple from the tree that God commanded not to. He sacrificed His Son to save us.
But why sacrifice his son to save us? If he is all powerful then he should have just forgiven them without the trouble of sending down Jesus to die.
Also, does Jesus dieing for our sins also mean Adam and Eve’s (and by extension our own sins) were also forgiven?
He sent his son to save us so that we can live eternal life.
That doesn’t answer my question.
The whole point of the sacrifice was that Jesus was both a martyr and a savior. But instead of just forgiving everyone, God chose to give people the ability to make choices. The sacrifice was meant to be an indicator to what God wanted people to believe, yet at the same time, God didn’t want to MAKE people believe. He wanted true believers that came to believe by their own free will. And yes, God DOES know who will believe and who won’t. All those who will be permitted into heaven have their name in the Book of Life.
That doesn’t mean that the future is predetermined. The way I see it (by the way, I don’t have typical views of Christianity. Some may say my beliefs are contradictory. I say, “If you don’t like it, tough shit, you don’t have to." God knows what choices we will be presented with, and what each choice will result in and that it goes in a chain like that. However, I also think that He CHOOSES not to simply predetermine each individual’s fate. He certainly has the power, being omnipotent. However, it doesn’t necessarily mean he uses that power.
So by giving people free will, he still knows what will happen, but it’s not because that’s what he makes happen. He simply knows, despite the fact that it is a choice that hasn’t happened yet and he didn’t influence. Not making sense? Read on.
Another thing you need to keep in mind is that you’re trying to remain within the confines of logic. The problem is, being omnipotent, God literally has the power to do ANYTHING, including anything which may defy logic.
So for example, you may say that, logically, if God knows how our lives will play out, you might say He didn’t give us free will. However, being omnipotent, God is capable of making both true.
Another one, the “Can God ask himself a question he doesn’t know the answer to?"
The answer is both yes and no. He can both know the answer, and yet at the same time, not know the answer. Seems illogical right? Well in comes omnipotence. This omnipotence literally means he has no limitations. He can do absolutely, positively anything, including defy logic.
You have to understand, omnipotence isn’t something that can truly be completely grasped by one who is not willing to understand that this is bypassing every limitation, law, rule, etc.
Omnipotent in itself is contradictory, it’s not possible. It’s simple logic. If it contradicts itself in this sort of way, it’s not possible. Your trying to talk your way out of having to provide a rational argument by decreeing by fiat that he can defy all laws or is outside time and/or science and doesn’t need to have the same argument as anything else. If your convinced by that then your welcome, but to me it’s irrational and ignorant.
ramunematt wrote:
Omnipotent in itself is contradictory, it’s not possible. It’s simple logic. If it contradicts itself in this sort of way, it’s not possible. Your trying to talk your way out of having to provide a rational argument by decreeing by fiat that he can defy all laws or is outside time and/or science and doesn’t need to have the same argument as anything else. If your convinced by that then your welcome, but to me it’s irrational and ignorant.
It’s only irrational and ignorant to you because that how you choose to see it.
I’m not saying that any scientific theories are wrong. I don’t have typical Christian beliefs. I believe that God created the original matter that was part of the Big Bang, and was the one that set it off and led to the creation of the universe. I’m saying God created the universe and created science and the like. I also tend to disregard the Garden of Eden to be honest. I believe the Big Bang theory, but I believe in God as the source.
I mean, why is it that it’s so impossible for there to be a God? You might say that science disproves it. Well I say God CREATED science and scientific laws to govern the universe he set into motion. I also believe he has the power of divine intervention, but chooses not to use it and allows scientific laws play things out so as to remain consistent.
And at the same time. You response really makes me think you either didn’t read or didn’t understand what I was trying to say.
Last Enemy wrote:
hey ram, jus curious, why dont u believe in god?
Wow, I could answer this in so many ways. I’ll answer it in two ways:
1. I couldn’t get past the whole talking snake thing
2. Why don’t you believe in Zeus? Why don’t you believe in Thor? Why don’t you believe in the celestial teapot or the flying spaghetti monster or any of the other gods of the hundreds of other religions? I could answer this question right now but first I want to see what your answer is.
why dont u try skipping the whole snake thing, look at everything that makes sense, look at everything that doesnt and try to make sense out of it(most atheist seem really discouraged when they dont understand something in the bible, first time they think its bull, they immeadiately turn there heads and forget about the whole religion stuff.).
i can also give u many reasons as to why i dont believe in zeus or the spaghetti monster, etc. but i dont want to go into detail cuz then im gonna have to spend a long time here, so let me keep it simple.
no one worships zeus anymore, if he was indeed the true god, this wouldnt be so.
no one worships the flying spaghetti monster, i mean seriously worship. its a joke actually.
i dont know about the celestial teapot, probably another joke.
hey ram jus watched ur dawkins video, i can see where u got all those questions about spaghetti monster, teapot, etc. u think i only believe in god cuz i was raised to believe in him?
another question id like to add, why do i have to answer ur question before u answer mine? i mean sure u have every right to ask a question, but all i want is ur answer man, u dont have to turn this thing into a debate.
p.s. i dont want ur answer to the second question its sort of rhetorical.
Last Enemy wrote:
hey ram, jus curious, why dont u believe in god?
Wow, I could answer this in so many ways. I’ll answer it in two ways:
1. I couldn’t get past the whole talking snake thing
2. Why don’t you believe in Zeus? Why don’t you believe in Thor? Why don’t you believe in the celestial teapot or the flying spaghetti monster or any of the other gods of the hundreds of other religions? I could answer this question right now but first I want to see what your answer is.
why dont u try skipping the whole snake thing, look at everything that makes sense, look at everything that doesnt and try to make sense out of it(most atheist seem really discouraged when they dont understand something in the bible, first time they think its bull, they immeadiately turn there heads and forget about the whole religion stuff.).
i can also give u many reasons as to why i dont believe in zeus or the spaghetti monster, etc. but i dont want to go into detail cuz then im gonna have to spend a long time here, so let me keep it simple.
no one worships zeus anymore, if he was indeed the true god, this wouldnt be so.
no one worships the flying spaghetti monster, i mean seriously worship. its a joke actually.
i dont know about the celestial teapot, probably another joke.
So your saying the only reason you worship god is because everyone else is doing it? Are you a conformist who only thinks what other people think? Try thinking for yourself for once, you don’t have to do something just because everyone else is doing it.
Last Enemy wrote:
hey ram jus watched ur dawkins video, i can see where u got all those questions about spaghetti monster, teapot, etc. u think i only believe in god cuz i was raised to believe in him?
another question id like to add, why do i have to answer ur question before u answer mine? i mean sure u have every right to ask a question, but all i want is ur answer man, u dont have to turn this thing into a debate.
p.s. i dont want ur answer to the second question its sort of rhetorical.
That is EXACTLY what I think. If you were born in India, you would probably be a Hindu. If you were born in Israel, you would probably be a Jew. If you were born in Japan, you would probably be a Buddhist. If you were born in Africa, you would probably worship the juju of the mountain.
Do you see the relationship between location and religion?
And I wasn’t aware you were trying to ask me questions. Fire away.
Last Enemy wrote:
hey ram jus watched ur dawkins video, i can see where u got all those questions about spaghetti monster, teapot, etc. u think i only believe in god cuz i was raised to believe in him?
another question id like to add, why do i have to answer ur question before u answer mine? i mean sure u have every right to ask a question, but all i want is ur answer man, u dont have to turn this thing into a debate.
p.s. i dont want ur answer to the second question its sort of rhetorical.
That is EXACTLY what I think. If you were born in India, you would probably be a Hindu. If you were born in Israel, you would probably be a Jew. If you were born in Japan, you would probably be a Buddhist. If you were born in Africa, you would probably worship the juju of the mountain.
Do you see the relationship between location and religion?
And I wasn’t aware you were trying to ask me questions. Fire away.
fire away eh? heres a question: why dont u believe in God.
Last Enemy wrote:
hey ram, jus curious, why dont u believe in god?
Wow, I could answer this in so many ways. I’ll answer it in two ways:
1. I couldn’t get past the whole talking snake thing
2. Why don’t you believe in Zeus? Why don’t you believe in Thor? Why don’t you believe in the celestial teapot or the flying spaghetti monster or any of the other gods of the hundreds of other religions? I could answer this question right now but first I want to see what your answer is.
Last Enemy wrote:
hey ram jus watched ur dawkins video, i can see where u got all those questions about spaghetti monster, teapot, etc. u think i only believe in god cuz i was raised to believe in him?
another question id like to add, why do i have to answer ur question before u answer mine? i mean sure u have every right to ask a question, but all i want is ur answer man, u dont have to turn this thing into a debate.
p.s. i dont want ur answer to the second question its sort of rhetorical.
That is EXACTLY what I think. If you were born in India, you would probably be a Hindu. If you were born in Israel, you would probably be a Jew. If you were born in Japan, you would probably be a Buddhist. If you were born in Africa, you would probably worship the juju of the mountain.
Do you see the relationship between location and religion?
And I wasn’t aware you were trying to ask me questions. Fire away.
fire away eh? heres a question: why dont u believe in God.
Well through the process of study and observation, asking questions and having my conscious raised I eventually grew out of it. Just as the day you grow out of believing the easter bunny because you realize how ridiculous it sounds.
That’s right people! Your existence is meaningless and arbitrary! Matt certainly knows all!
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Dogbert said the deepest thing ever.
“It is all a part of the big illusion we perpetuate upon ourselves and which is in turn perpetuated upon us. When we believe we engage the illusion, when we stop believing we shatter the illusion and ourselves in the process because we are part of it."
Nobody will ever be able to disprove god, no matter how advanced science gets, sure enough Christians will just try their damned hardest to fit it around science.
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Invade Southern Ireland, it just looks out of place.
God knows what choices we will be presented with, and what each choice will result in and that it goes in a chain like that. However, I also think that He CHOOSES not to simply predetermine each individual’s fate. He certainly has the power, being omnipotent. However, it doesn’t necessarily mean he uses that power.
its me wrote:
