Chilly man wrote:
Haylias,
Could you elaborate on your answers to CRYS14? I didn’t understand and, if you’d let me, I’d like to respectfully debate this with you:
#1. “421” what?
#2. I understood this one.
#3. What morals? You said “more
than these”. What these?
#4. What are you defining there?
Thanks.
Number 2 and 3 are links, and I am defining the word “Fairy Tale”.
Thanks, My eyes must be goin bad, I didn’t even see the blue print the first time. Sorry to be a pain but what are the 421?
421 contradictions within the bible.
OK Haylias, I’m going to take the most important of the 421 points from your ref. site, the comparison of Romans 4:2 vs. James 2:21 because it is one of the most important tenets of our beliefs. Whether you are saved by faith or works. It may take time because I’m not smart enough to know exactly why there seems to be a contradiction, but I know a bible expert that I can e-mail that will give me the correct answer.
It’ll take a few days to get his response. Hope you don’t mind. I’ll work on your other three points while I’m waiting and when I get all the answers I’ll put them in here. Is that OK with you?
Not a problem.
Haylias,
I sent the e-mail but I also found an answer on my own:
The two verses that seem to be in conflict are Romans 4:3 where Paul said that Abraham believed and it was credited to him as righteousness and James 2:21 which says that Abraham was considered righteous for what he did.
These two seemingly contradictory passages are reconciled by Hebrews 11:17-19. There we read, By faith Abraham, when God tested him, offered Isaac as a sacrifice. He who had received the promises was about to sacrifice his one and only son, even though God had said to him, “It is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned.” Abraham reasoned that God could raise the dead, and figuratively speaking, he did receive Isaac back from death.
Abraham’s faith was so strong that he agreed to put Isaac to death, even though he knew that all of God’s promises were supposed to come true through Isaac . He believed God would raise Isaac from the dead if necessary to fulfill them.
It was his faith that prompted him to obey and his faith was made obvious by his actions. There is no conflict between the two statements. James was writing to believers and his point was that true faith will always result in action. A friend of mine used to say, “If what you say you believe doesn’t result in action then it’s doubtful that you really believe it.” I’ll still work on your other points. Thanks for your patience and please let me know your trsponse to this post. Thanks.
Haylias wrote:
The Bible doesn’t get my vote for various reasons.
1. Riddled with contradictions
2. Scientific innacuracies
3. Morals I don’t agree with (sometimes)
4. Sounds like a fairy tale book.
1. what contradictions?
2. science may be the answer to a lot of things but not to everything has to be explained by science
3. like what morals? (just curious)
4. there are a lot of deaths and things dont always end happily ever after... how the hell is that a fairy tale? the main character dies (Jesus) and there is a lot of death and sometimes torture
4. “1 a: a story (as for children) involving fantastic forces and beings” - Mirriam Webster
lol...
__________________
Cid wrote:
You flame religions and its followers without even considering their side of the story. You’re not much different from Hitler with his extermination of the jews
Gplex wrote:
This is mainly for cid...
What makes you think that the bible wasnt written by ignorant primitive men?
its like when you higher some one to right your paper you give them what you have what facts and stuff and they put it together for you
What makes you think some random book in the libary wasnt written by god, but some guy taken credit for his work?
__________________
Cid wrote:
You flame religions and its followers without even considering their side of the story. You’re not much different from Hitler with his extermination of the jews
Haylias wrote:
The Bible doesn’t get my vote for various reasons.
1. Riddled with contradictions
2. Scientific innacuracies
3. Morals I don’t agree with (sometimes)
4. Sounds like a fairy tale book.
1. what contradictions?
2. science may be the answer to a lot of things but not to everything has to be explained by science
3. like what morals? (just curious)
4. there are a lot of deaths and things dont always end happily ever after... how the hell is that a fairy tale? the main character dies (Jesus) and there is a lot of death and sometimes torture
4. “1 a: a story (as for children) involving fantastic forces and beings” - Mirriam Webster
My answer for #2
It doesn’t exactly say that Haylias, I’m not an expert but the Bible experts have figured the 6000 years based on things in the Bible that give clues to their time of occurance including (I believe) actual dates written in the Bible. I do know that they have gone backwards from the present and, using the ages of people listed in the Bible, they’ve also used that to confirm time
based on the present Jewish calendar which continues with the date from it’s inception. My word is not gospel and I’m not as good at explaining as you are but I have read and seen on TV about many Christian scientists that have refuted the age of the earth and other things purported to be millions of years old based on carbon dating. They have proven that carbon dating is not reliable. Many secular scientists are also finding proof that the supposed age of the earth is not as has been thought for so long and have published their facts and evidence.
Your point about the Bib;e is just your opinion and not fact and I’m surprised at you for using that as a point of reference. You have a right to your opinion that it is not a fact based book, but present some evidence that it is a “fairy tale”. Did the brothers Grimm include it as one of their fairy tale books?
Haylias wrote:
The Bible doesn’t get my vote for various reasons.
1. Riddled with contradictions
2. Scientific innacuracies
3. Morals I don’t agree with (sometimes)
4. Sounds like a fairy tale book.
1. what contradictions?
2. science may be the answer to a lot of things but not to everything has to be explained by science
3. like what morals? (just curious)
4. there are a lot of deaths and things dont always end happily ever after... how the hell is that a fairy tale? the main character dies (Jesus) and there is a lot of death and sometimes torture
4. “1 a: a story (as for children) involving fantastic forces and beings” - Mirriam Webster
heh nope your wrong... fairy tales are stuff that has happy endings and the bible isnt all happy endings... and wow i never noticed that the bible had stuff like mythical creatures (sarcasm) thats a fairy tale
__________________
“Sometimes i feel like a butterfly trapped inside a cocoon
wishing i could spread my wings and fly away”
Shadow Archon wrote:
What makes you think that it was?
The fact that God didn’t personally write it and send the book down, and apparently “talked” to other people to get it to write it for him, and the multiple revisions as well, at least throws doubt into the idea of God having wrote it.
umm... have you read it? its actually accounts of other peoples lives. and the only part that god “talked” people into writing was the ten commandments.
I’m addressing the idea that God wrote the bible, though.
crys14 wrote:
umm... it wasnt written by only one person...
My correction, then, but general point is still there.
God didn’t write the bible tho. People wrote accounts of their lives and for us to know how we should live and what could happen during God’s anger or during god’s happiness. It was also written as a code we should follow and what is right or wrong. the new testament are recordings of Jesus’s life and what he did for God and for us. How we should be greatful because he died in the cross for our sins so we wouldnt all end up in hell. And anyways... have you guys thought of something? suppose you guys are right and God doesnt exist... we have nothing to lose. But turn it around if God does exist then where will you guys end up?
It is a sad choice to do something only because of what might happen to you.
we dont just do it because of what MIGHT happen to us... we do it because we believe in God and because we trust him fully. and we have faith in him. it would be stupid to do something just because your scared at what MIGHT happen. i’m just saying though, where would you guys end up? i dont worship God just because i’m scared of him i do it because i believe in him.
We would end up in hell. Where would you end up if one of the 6 billion or so other religions are correct and yours is wrong? What makes you so sure you are right? And thats just the active religions there have been many more.
i mean it towards the atheist who dont believe in God or anything like that...
__________________
“Sometimes i feel like a butterfly trapped inside a cocoon
wishing i could spread my wings and fly away”
Haylias wrote:
The Bible doesn’t get my vote for various reasons.
1. Riddled with contradictions
2. Scientific innacuracies
3. Morals I don’t agree with (sometimes)
4. Sounds like a fairy tale book.
1. what contradictions?
2. science may be the answer to a lot of things but not to everything has to be explained by science
3. like what morals? (just curious)
4. there are a lot of deaths and things dont always end happily ever after... how the hell is that a fairy tale? the main character dies (Jesus) and there is a lot of death and sometimes torture
4. “1 a: a story (as for children) involving fantastic forces and beings” - Mirriam Webster
heh nope your wrong... fairy tales are stuff that has happy endings and the bible isnt all happy endings... and wow i never noticed that the bible had stuff like mythical creatures (sarcasm) thats a fairy tale
Haylias wrote:
The Bible doesn’t get my vote for various reasons.
1. Riddled with contradictions
2. Scientific innacuracies
3. Morals I don’t agree with (sometimes)
4. Sounds like a fairy tale book.
1. what contradictions?
2. science may be the answer to a lot of things but not to everything has to be explained by science
3. like what morals? (just curious)
4. there are a lot of deaths and things dont always end happily ever after... how the hell is that a fairy tale? the main character dies (Jesus) and there is a lot of death and sometimes torture
4. “1 a: a story (as for children) involving fantastic forces and beings” - Mirriam Webster
heh nope your wrong... fairy tales are stuff that has happy endings and the bible isnt all happy endings... and wow i never noticed that the bible had stuff like mythical creatures (sarcasm) thats a fairy tale
Shadow Archon wrote:
What makes you think that it was?
The fact that God didn’t personally write it and send the book down, and apparently “talked” to other people to get it to write it for him, and the multiple revisions as well, at least throws doubt into the idea of God having wrote it.
umm... have you read it? its actually accounts of other peoples lives. and the only part that god “talked” people into writing was the ten commandments.
I’m addressing the idea that God wrote the bible, though.
crys14 wrote:
umm... it wasnt written by only one person...
My correction, then, but general point is still there.
God didn’t write the bible tho. People wrote accounts of their lives and for us to know how we should live and what could happen during God’s anger or during god’s happiness. It was also written as a code we should follow and what is right or wrong. the new testament are recordings of Jesus’s life and what he did for God and for us. How we should be greatful because he died in the cross for our sins so we wouldnt all end up in hell. And anyways... have you guys thought of something? suppose you guys are right and God doesnt exist... we have nothing to lose. But turn it around if God does exist then where will you guys end up?
It is a sad choice to do something only because of what might happen to you.
we dont just do it because of what MIGHT happen to us... we do it because we believe in God and because we trust him fully. and we have faith in him. it would be stupid to do something just because your scared at what MIGHT happen. i’m just saying though, where would you guys end up? i dont worship God just because i’m scared of him i do it because i believe in him.
We would end up in hell. Where would you end up if one of the 6 billion or so other religions are correct and yours is wrong? What makes you so sure you are right? And thats just the active religions there have been many more.
i mean it towards the atheist who dont believe in God or anything like that...
I know..like me. What I said still stands. Are you christian?
Haylias wrote:
The Bible doesn’t get my vote for various reasons.
1. Riddled with contradictions
2. Scientific innacuracies
3. Morals I don’t agree with (sometimes)
4. Sounds like a fairy tale book.
1. what contradictions?
2. science may be the answer to a lot of things but not to everything has to be explained by science
3. like what morals? (just curious)
4. there are a lot of deaths and things dont always end happily ever after... how the hell is that a fairy tale? the main character dies (Jesus) and there is a lot of death and sometimes torture
4. “1 a: a story (as for children) involving fantastic forces and beings” - Mirriam Webster
heh nope your wrong... fairy tales are stuff that has happy endings and the bible isnt all happy endings... and wow i never noticed that the bible had stuff like mythical creatures (sarcasm) thats a fairy tale
But wild beasts of the desert will lie there
And their houses will be full of owls
Ostriches will dwell there,
And wild goats will caper there
and to the unicorns... ever heard of a figure of speech? (sarcasm again)
and for the cockatrices... Isaiah 11:8
The nursing child shall play by the cobra’s hole,
And the weaned child shall put his hand in the viper’s den.
sheesh i swear that website doesnt have the real verses its rephrasing them.
Well wait, it depends on the version. You realize that they are all translated from dead languages and scribes had to translate all that letter by letter by hand...Yeah there could be A LOT of differences.
Shadow Archon wrote:
What makes you think that it was?
The fact that God didn’t personally write it and send the book down, and apparently “talked” to other people to get it to write it for him, and the multiple revisions as well, at least throws doubt into the idea of God having wrote it.
umm... have you read it? its actually accounts of other peoples lives. and the only part that god “talked” people into writing was the ten commandments.
I’m addressing the idea that God wrote the bible, though.
crys14 wrote:
umm... it wasnt written by only one person...
My correction, then, but general point is still there.
God didn’t write the bible tho. People wrote accounts of their lives and for us to know how we should live and what could happen during God’s anger or during god’s happiness. It was also written as a code we should follow and what is right or wrong. the new testament are recordings of Jesus’s life and what he did for God and for us. How we should be greatful because he died in the cross for our sins so we wouldnt all end up in hell. And anyways... have you guys thought of something? suppose you guys are right and God doesnt exist... we have nothing to lose. But turn it around if God does exist then where will you guys end up?
It is a sad choice to do something only because of what might happen to you.
we dont just do it because of what MIGHT happen to us... we do it because we believe in God and because we trust him fully. and we have faith in him. it would be stupid to do something just because your scared at what MIGHT happen. i’m just saying though, where would you guys end up? i dont worship God just because i’m scared of him i do it because i believe in him.
We would end up in hell. Where would you end up if one of the 6 billion or so other religions are correct and yours is wrong? What makes you so sure you are right? And thats just the active religions there have been many more.
i mean it towards the atheist who dont believe in God or anything like that...
I know..like me. What I said still stands. Are you christian?
yup... but i honestly was looking forward to a debate since i havent really been in one for about a month... thats why i came on
__________________
“Sometimes i feel like a butterfly trapped inside a cocoon
wishing i could spread my wings and fly away”
Haylias wrote:
The Bible doesn’t get my vote for various reasons.
1. Riddled with contradictions
2. Scientific innacuracies
3. Morals I don’t agree with (sometimes)
4. Sounds like a fairy tale book.
1. what contradictions?
2. science may be the answer to a lot of things but not to everything has to be explained by science
3. like what morals? (just curious)
4. there are a lot of deaths and things dont always end happily ever after... how the hell is that a fairy tale? the main character dies (Jesus) and there is a lot of death and sometimes torture
4. “1 a: a story (as for children) involving fantastic forces and beings” - Mirriam Webster
heh nope your wrong... fairy tales are stuff that has happy endings and the bible isnt all happy endings... and wow i never noticed that the bible had stuff like mythical creatures (sarcasm) thats a fairy tale
But wild beasts of the desert will lie there
And their houses will be full of owls
Ostriches will dwell there,
And wild goats will caper there
and to the unicorns... ever heard of a figure of speech? (sarcasm again)
and for the cockatrices... Isaiah 11:8
The nursing child shall play by the cobra’s hole,
And the weaned child shall put his hand in the viper’s den.
sheesh i swear that website doesnt have the real verses its rephrasing them.
Well wait, it depends on the version. You realize that they are all translated from dead languages and scribes had to translate all that letter by letter by hand...Yeah there could be A LOT of differences.
yup but he’s saying that the bible is just a fairy tale cuz it has unicorns and cockatrices in them... i have two and it doesnt mention them... if it was meant literatly then it would still mention it
__________________
“Sometimes i feel like a butterfly trapped inside a cocoon
wishing i could spread my wings and fly away”
Shadow Archon wrote:
What makes you think that it was?
The fact that God didn’t personally write it and send the book down, and apparently “talked” to other people to get it to write it for him, and the multiple revisions as well, at least throws doubt into the idea of God having wrote it.
umm... have you read it? its actually accounts of other peoples lives. and the only part that god “talked” people into writing was the ten commandments.
I’m addressing the idea that God wrote the bible, though.
crys14 wrote:
umm... it wasnt written by only one person...
My correction, then, but general point is still there.
God didn’t write the bible tho. People wrote accounts of their lives and for us to know how we should live and what could happen during God’s anger or during god’s happiness. It was also written as a code we should follow and what is right or wrong. the new testament are recordings of Jesus’s life and what he did for God and for us. How we should be greatful because he died in the cross for our sins so we wouldnt all end up in hell. And anyways... have you guys thought of something? suppose you guys are right and God doesnt exist... we have nothing to lose. But turn it around if God does exist then where will you guys end up?
It is a sad choice to do something only because of what might happen to you.
we dont just do it because of what MIGHT happen to us... we do it because we believe in God and because we trust him fully. and we have faith in him. it would be stupid to do something just because your scared at what MIGHT happen. i’m just saying though, where would you guys end up? i dont worship God just because i’m scared of him i do it because i believe in him.
We would end up in hell. Where would you end up if one of the 6 billion or so other religions are correct and yours is wrong? What makes you so sure you are right? And thats just the active religions there have been many more.
i mean it towards the atheist who dont believe in God or anything like that...
I know..like me. What I said still stands. Are you christian?
yup... but i honestly was looking forward to a debate since i havent really been in one for about a month... thats why i came on
Oh ok well I was just saying that both of us could be wrong we have the exact same chances.
But if your looking for a debate the religion forum is the place to go cause no one agrees on anything haha.
Haylias wrote:
The Bible doesn’t get my vote for various reasons.
1. Riddled with contradictions
2. Scientific innacuracies
3. Morals I don’t agree with (sometimes)
4. Sounds like a fairy tale book.
1. what contradictions?
2. science may be the answer to a lot of things but not to everything has to be explained by science
3. like what morals? (just curious)
4. there are a lot of deaths and things dont always end happily ever after... how the hell is that a fairy tale? the main character dies (Jesus) and there is a lot of death and sometimes torture
4. “1 a: a story (as for children) involving fantastic forces and beings” - Mirriam Webster
heh nope your wrong... fairy tales are stuff that has happy endings and the bible isnt all happy endings... and wow i never noticed that the bible had stuff like mythical creatures (sarcasm) thats a fairy tale
But wild beasts of the desert will lie there
And their houses will be full of owls
Ostriches will dwell there,
And wild goats will caper there
and to the unicorns... ever heard of a figure of speech? (sarcasm again)
and for the cockatrices... Isaiah 11:8
The nursing child shall play by the cobra’s hole,
And the weaned child shall put his hand in the viper’s den.
sheesh i swear that website doesnt have the real verses its rephrasing them.
Well wait, it depends on the version. You realize that they are all translated from dead languages and scribes had to translate all that letter by letter by hand...Yeah there could be A LOT of differences.
yup but he’s saying that the bible is just a fairy tale cuz it has unicorns and cockatrices in them... i have two and it doesnt mention them... if it was meant literatly then it would still mention it
Eh, could be. Either way, this is not even the best argument against the bible at all. Rather it’s infallibility.
Forums Index >
Religion 
