KingBoo wrote:
Theists don’t need a religion, it simply means you belive in a God.
Atheits or Anti-Theists, believe in no greater power.
Me myself am just a theist, and God to me isn’t physical, it is not mass nor energy, it is the infinite mind behind reality, without it reality has no purpose, the laws of Science exist as they are for no reason, and ultimatly everything exists for nothing, everything is the way it is just because it is. Well, theres my philosophy, agree or disagree?
Disagree. Why is it you need a higher power to have a purpose? Okay, one thing I am a Nihilist, I don’t believe there IS a purpose to life, it’s just what you make it. So why exactly do you need purpose. Though I do agree theists don’t need religion.
Think of it this why, the specific laws of science, the different properties of different atoms, our MINDS! Do you really think these exist for no reason, that they just are what reality is? Or is there something that is un observable and uncomprehensible that gave truth to existence and laws on which reality is set on.
What do you mean by purpose? Do you mean we all have some plan to follow? Then no. If you mean biologically, it is to reproduce. See, the reason science, and atoms exist is because that is what happened as a result of the Big Bang I am guessing.
No, just why is reality the way it is. The Big Bang therory is that for all eternity, all the atoms in space have been collapsing into an absolute mass and then re-scattering, and this happens in a continuos cycle, if I were just a mere compilation of mindless atoms would I be talking to about this right now?
Actually it’s all chemical reactions in your brain that is causing you to react the way you are and do the things you do. What gives you a conciousness is something similar, Reality, is the way it is because....idk, it just is. No one knows WHY it is.
Either it just is or it was set the way it is. If you believe it wasn’t set then you beileve the reality of all existense, and what is real is just a reality of a reality. Laws have never changed nor not existed, they just have, and there has been infinite yous and mes because reality is just that, existence of everything is just a bunch of set laws...
Reality is merely how we percieve the universe. But yeah basically. Reality just is. Just like you probably think God just is.
God isn’t a person, it is a force that set how things are. Reality is everything that exists and how it exists, no one knows reality. Also, were does the chemical reaction in my brain start and how do I control these reactions? This answer scientists cannot find to this day and will never find it, the mind has no source, it goes on and on...
You don’t. You have the ILLUSION of control, but you have no actual control. It’s how the mind works. It’s source is simply chemicals and such. Nothing more. The mind dies.
So you can either beleive we have an illusion of control or free will, I don’t believe im typing this because thats just what the chemicals are doing.
The chemical reactions in your brain are making you think like that and responding in such a manner. Tell me how can you have free will when everything you do is based on expirence? You hesitate before jumping off something high because you know it could hurt you. That is an example. You don’t have free will. Simply a product of natural process at work.
The voices in my head that are telling me i’m right are just the chemicals? I can make my own choices and think of things that I have no experiences with, chemicals cannot generate complex thoughs, they can only generate instincts
This schematic shows the brain regions (green) from which the outcome of a participant’s decision can be predicted before it is made. Courtesy John-Dylan Haynes.
You may think you decided to read this story — but in fact, your brain made the decision long before you knew about it.
In a study published Sunday in Nature Neuroscience, researchers using brain scanners could predict people’s decisions seven seconds before the test subjects were even aware of making them.
The decision studied — whether to hit a button with one’s left or right hand — may not be representative of complicated choices that are more integrally tied to our sense of self-direction. Regardless, the findings raise profound questions about the nature of self and autonomy: How free is our will? Is conscious choice just an illusion?
“Your decisions are strongly prepared by brain activity. By the time consciousness kicks in, most of the work has already been done," said study co-author John-Dylan Haynes, a Max Planck Institute neuroscientist.
Haynes updated a classic experiment by the late Benjamin Libet, who showed that a brain region involved in coordinating motor activity fired a fraction of a second before test subjects chose to push a button. Later studies supported Libet’s theory that subconscious activity preceded and determined conscious choice — but none found such a vast gap between a decision and the experience of making it as Haynes' study has.
In the seven seconds before Haynes' test subjects chose to push a button, activity shifted in their frontopolar cortex, a brain region associated with high-level planning. Soon afterwards, activity moved to the parietal cortex, a region of sensory integration. Haynes' team monitored these shifting neural patterns using a functional MRI machine.
Taken together, the patterns consistently predicted whether test subjects eventually pushed a button with their left or right hand — a choice that, to them, felt like the outcome of conscious deliberation. For those accustomed to thinking of themselves as having free will, the implications are far more unsettling than learning about the physiological basis of other brain functions.
Caveats remain, holding open the door for free will. For instance, the experiment may not reflect the mental dynamics of other, more complicated decisions.
“Real-life decisions — am I going to buy this house or that one, take this job or that — aren’t decisions that we can implement very well in our brain scanners," said Haynes.
Also, the predictions were not completely accurate. Maybe free will enters at the last moment, allowing a person to override an unpalatable subconscious decision.
“We can’t rule out that there’s a free will that kicks in at this late point," said Haynes, who intends to study this phenomenon next. “But I don’t think it’s plausible."
That implausibility doesn’t disturb Haynes.
“It’s not like you’re a machine. Your brain activity is the physiological substance in which your personality and wishes and desires operate," he said.
The unease people feel at the potential unreality of free will, said National Institutes of Health neuroscientist Mark Hallett, originates in a misconception of self as separate from the brain.
“That’s the same notion as the mind being separate from the body — and I don’t think anyone really believes that," said Hallett. “A different way of thinking about it is that your consciousness is only aware of some of the things your brain is doing."
Hallett doubts that free will exists as a separate, independent force.
“If it is, we haven’t put our finger on it," he said. “But we’re happy to keep looking.“
Left and Right buttons are one story, but thoughts and developed ideas like the ones used in this discussion were having cannot be decided. The brain does work in a specific way, but the complex thoughts and ideas we generate are not the product of random chemical reactions, are conciousness exists as instict, like button pressing, is not part of conciousness. But if one button said I believe in a reason for this choice, and the other said I beleive that the chemicals chose this, then this experiment would mean something.
And you are a neuroscientist now? Did you not see how he said implausibility for free will? The fact that the brain sends a signal BEFORE the conciousness kicks in should tell you something.
That was of pressing the left or right button, your not in deep thought of what button to press, your just like, “Left, because I feel like it”. You feel like it because of this reaction of your brain, but deep thoughts are GENERATED, they don’t just happen because of chance.
KingBoo wrote:
Theists don’t need a religion, it simply means you belive in a God.
Atheits or Anti-Theists, believe in no greater power.
Me myself am just a theist, and God to me isn’t physical, it is not mass nor energy, it is the infinite mind behind reality, without it reality has no purpose, the laws of Science exist as they are for no reason, and ultimatly everything exists for nothing, everything is the way it is just because it is. Well, theres my philosophy, agree or disagree?
Disagree. Why is it you need a higher power to have a purpose? Okay, one thing I am a Nihilist, I don’t believe there IS a purpose to life, it’s just what you make it. So why exactly do you need purpose. Though I do agree theists don’t need religion.
Think of it this why, the specific laws of science, the different properties of different atoms, our MINDS! Do you really think these exist for no reason, that they just are what reality is? Or is there something that is un observable and uncomprehensible that gave truth to existence and laws on which reality is set on.
What do you mean by purpose? Do you mean we all have some plan to follow? Then no. If you mean biologically, it is to reproduce. See, the reason science, and atoms exist is because that is what happened as a result of the Big Bang I am guessing.
No, just why is reality the way it is. The Big Bang therory is that for all eternity, all the atoms in space have been collapsing into an absolute mass and then re-scattering, and this happens in a continuos cycle, if I were just a mere compilation of mindless atoms would I be talking to about this right now?
Actually it’s all chemical reactions in your brain that is causing you to react the way you are and do the things you do. What gives you a conciousness is something similar, Reality, is the way it is because....idk, it just is. No one knows WHY it is.
Either it just is or it was set the way it is. If you believe it wasn’t set then you beileve the reality of all existense, and what is real is just a reality of a reality. Laws have never changed nor not existed, they just have, and there has been infinite yous and mes because reality is just that, existence of everything is just a bunch of set laws...
Reality is merely how we percieve the universe. But yeah basically. Reality just is. Just like you probably think God just is.
God isn’t a person, it is a force that set how things are. Reality is everything that exists and how it exists, no one knows reality. Also, were does the chemical reaction in my brain start and how do I control these reactions? This answer scientists cannot find to this day and will never find it, the mind has no source, it goes on and on...
You don’t. You have the ILLUSION of control, but you have no actual control. It’s how the mind works. It’s source is simply chemicals and such. Nothing more. The mind dies.
So you can either beleive we have an illusion of control or free will, I don’t believe im typing this because thats just what the chemicals are doing.
The chemical reactions in your brain are making you think like that and responding in such a manner. Tell me how can you have free will when everything you do is based on expirence? You hesitate before jumping off something high because you know it could hurt you. That is an example. You don’t have free will. Simply a product of natural process at work.
The voices in my head that are telling me i’m right are just the chemicals? I can make my own choices and think of things that I have no experiences with, chemicals cannot generate complex thoughs, they can only generate instincts
This schematic shows the brain regions (green) from which the outcome of a participant’s decision can be predicted before it is made. Courtesy John-Dylan Haynes.
You may think you decided to read this story — but in fact, your brain made the decision long before you knew about it.
In a study published Sunday in Nature Neuroscience, researchers using brain scanners could predict people’s decisions seven seconds before the test subjects were even aware of making them.
The decision studied — whether to hit a button with one’s left or right hand — may not be representative of complicated choices that are more integrally tied to our sense of self-direction. Regardless, the findings raise profound questions about the nature of self and autonomy: How free is our will? Is conscious choice just an illusion?
“Your decisions are strongly prepared by brain activity. By the time consciousness kicks in, most of the work has already been done," said study co-author John-Dylan Haynes, a Max Planck Institute neuroscientist.
Haynes updated a classic experiment by the late Benjamin Libet, who showed that a brain region involved in coordinating motor activity fired a fraction of a second before test subjects chose to push a button. Later studies supported Libet’s theory that subconscious activity preceded and determined conscious choice — but none found such a vast gap between a decision and the experience of making it as Haynes' study has.
In the seven seconds before Haynes' test subjects chose to push a button, activity shifted in their frontopolar cortex, a brain region associated with high-level planning. Soon afterwards, activity moved to the parietal cortex, a region of sensory integration. Haynes' team monitored these shifting neural patterns using a functional MRI machine.
Taken together, the patterns consistently predicted whether test subjects eventually pushed a button with their left or right hand — a choice that, to them, felt like the outcome of conscious deliberation. For those accustomed to thinking of themselves as having free will, the implications are far more unsettling than learning about the physiological basis of other brain functions.
Caveats remain, holding open the door for free will. For instance, the experiment may not reflect the mental dynamics of other, more complicated decisions.
“Real-life decisions — am I going to buy this house or that one, take this job or that — aren’t decisions that we can implement very well in our brain scanners," said Haynes.
Also, the predictions were not completely accurate. Maybe free will enters at the last moment, allowing a person to override an unpalatable subconscious decision.
“We can’t rule out that there’s a free will that kicks in at this late point," said Haynes, who intends to study this phenomenon next. “But I don’t think it’s plausible."
That implausibility doesn’t disturb Haynes.
“It’s not like you’re a machine. Your brain activity is the physiological substance in which your personality and wishes and desires operate," he said.
The unease people feel at the potential unreality of free will, said National Institutes of Health neuroscientist Mark Hallett, originates in a misconception of self as separate from the brain.
“That’s the same notion as the mind being separate from the body — and I don’t think anyone really believes that," said Hallett. “A different way of thinking about it is that your consciousness is only aware of some of the things your brain is doing."
Hallett doubts that free will exists as a separate, independent force.
“If it is, we haven’t put our finger on it," he said. “But we’re happy to keep looking.“
Left and Right buttons are one story, but thoughts and developed ideas like the ones used in this discussion were having cannot be decided. The brain does work in a specific way, but the complex thoughts and ideas we generate are not the product of random chemical reactions, are conciousness exists as instict, like button pressing, is not part of conciousness. But if one button said I believe in a reason for this choice, and the other said I beleive that the chemicals chose this, then this experiment would mean something.
And you are a neuroscientist now? Did you not see how he said implausibility for free will? The fact that the brain sends a signal BEFORE the conciousness kicks in should tell you something.
That was of pressing the left or right button, your not in deep thought of what button to press, your just like, “Left, because I feel like it”. You feel like it because of this reaction of your brain, but deep thoughts are GENERATED, they don’t just happen because of chance.
And you know this how? This is Neuro Scientists. I think they know how to validate their own expirement about free will. Also, did you not read it all?
“It’s not like you’re a machine. Your brain activity is the physiological substance in which your personality and wishes and desires operate,"
KingBoo wrote:
Theists don’t need a religion, it simply means you belive in a God.
Atheits or Anti-Theists, believe in no greater power.
Me myself am just a theist, and God to me isn’t physical, it is not mass nor energy, it is the infinite mind behind reality, without it reality has no purpose, the laws of Science exist as they are for no reason, and ultimatly everything exists for nothing, everything is the way it is just because it is. Well, theres my philosophy, agree or disagree?
Disagree. Why is it you need a higher power to have a purpose? Okay, one thing I am a Nihilist, I don’t believe there IS a purpose to life, it’s just what you make it. So why exactly do you need purpose. Though I do agree theists don’t need religion.
Think of it this why, the specific laws of science, the different properties of different atoms, our MINDS! Do you really think these exist for no reason, that they just are what reality is? Or is there something that is un observable and uncomprehensible that gave truth to existence and laws on which reality is set on.
What do you mean by purpose? Do you mean we all have some plan to follow? Then no. If you mean biologically, it is to reproduce. See, the reason science, and atoms exist is because that is what happened as a result of the Big Bang I am guessing.
No, just why is reality the way it is. The Big Bang therory is that for all eternity, all the atoms in space have been collapsing into an absolute mass and then re-scattering, and this happens in a continuos cycle, if I were just a mere compilation of mindless atoms would I be talking to about this right now?
Actually it’s all chemical reactions in your brain that is causing you to react the way you are and do the things you do. What gives you a conciousness is something similar, Reality, is the way it is because....idk, it just is. No one knows WHY it is.
Either it just is or it was set the way it is. If you believe it wasn’t set then you beileve the reality of all existense, and what is real is just a reality of a reality. Laws have never changed nor not existed, they just have, and there has been infinite yous and mes because reality is just that, existence of everything is just a bunch of set laws...
Reality is merely how we percieve the universe. But yeah basically. Reality just is. Just like you probably think God just is.
God isn’t a person, it is a force that set how things are. Reality is everything that exists and how it exists, no one knows reality. Also, were does the chemical reaction in my brain start and how do I control these reactions? This answer scientists cannot find to this day and will never find it, the mind has no source, it goes on and on...
You don’t. You have the ILLUSION of control, but you have no actual control. It’s how the mind works. It’s source is simply chemicals and such. Nothing more. The mind dies.
So you can either beleive we have an illusion of control or free will, I don’t believe im typing this because thats just what the chemicals are doing.
The chemical reactions in your brain are making you think like that and responding in such a manner. Tell me how can you have free will when everything you do is based on expirence? You hesitate before jumping off something high because you know it could hurt you. That is an example. You don’t have free will. Simply a product of natural process at work.
The voices in my head that are telling me i’m right are just the chemicals? I can make my own choices and think of things that I have no experiences with, chemicals cannot generate complex thoughs, they can only generate instincts
This schematic shows the brain regions (green) from which the outcome of a participant’s decision can be predicted before it is made. Courtesy John-Dylan Haynes.
You may think you decided to read this story — but in fact, your brain made the decision long before you knew about it.
In a study published Sunday in Nature Neuroscience, researchers using brain scanners could predict people’s decisions seven seconds before the test subjects were even aware of making them.
The decision studied — whether to hit a button with one’s left or right hand — may not be representative of complicated choices that are more integrally tied to our sense of self-direction. Regardless, the findings raise profound questions about the nature of self and autonomy: How free is our will? Is conscious choice just an illusion?
“Your decisions are strongly prepared by brain activity. By the time consciousness kicks in, most of the work has already been done," said study co-author John-Dylan Haynes, a Max Planck Institute neuroscientist.
Haynes updated a classic experiment by the late Benjamin Libet, who showed that a brain region involved in coordinating motor activity fired a fraction of a second before test subjects chose to push a button. Later studies supported Libet’s theory that subconscious activity preceded and determined conscious choice — but none found such a vast gap between a decision and the experience of making it as Haynes' study has.
In the seven seconds before Haynes' test subjects chose to push a button, activity shifted in their frontopolar cortex, a brain region associated with high-level planning. Soon afterwards, activity moved to the parietal cortex, a region of sensory integration. Haynes' team monitored these shifting neural patterns using a functional MRI machine.
Taken together, the patterns consistently predicted whether test subjects eventually pushed a button with their left or right hand — a choice that, to them, felt like the outcome of conscious deliberation. For those accustomed to thinking of themselves as having free will, the implications are far more unsettling than learning about the physiological basis of other brain functions.
Caveats remain, holding open the door for free will. For instance, the experiment may not reflect the mental dynamics of other, more complicated decisions.
“Real-life decisions — am I going to buy this house or that one, take this job or that — aren’t decisions that we can implement very well in our brain scanners," said Haynes.
Also, the predictions were not completely accurate. Maybe free will enters at the last moment, allowing a person to override an unpalatable subconscious decision.
“We can’t rule out that there’s a free will that kicks in at this late point," said Haynes, who intends to study this phenomenon next. “But I don’t think it’s plausible."
That implausibility doesn’t disturb Haynes.
“It’s not like you’re a machine. Your brain activity is the physiological substance in which your personality and wishes and desires operate," he said.
The unease people feel at the potential unreality of free will, said National Institutes of Health neuroscientist Mark Hallett, originates in a misconception of self as separate from the brain.
“That’s the same notion as the mind being separate from the body — and I don’t think anyone really believes that," said Hallett. “A different way of thinking about it is that your consciousness is only aware of some of the things your brain is doing."
Hallett doubts that free will exists as a separate, independent force.
“If it is, we haven’t put our finger on it," he said. “But we’re happy to keep looking.“
Left and Right buttons are one story, but thoughts and developed ideas like the ones used in this discussion were having cannot be decided. The brain does work in a specific way, but the complex thoughts and ideas we generate are not the product of random chemical reactions, are conciousness exists as instict, like button pressing, is not part of conciousness. But if one button said I believe in a reason for this choice, and the other said I beleive that the chemicals chose this, then this experiment would mean something.
And you are a neuroscientist now? Did you not see how he said implausibility for free will? The fact that the brain sends a signal BEFORE the conciousness kicks in should tell you something.
That was of pressing the left or right button, your not in deep thought of what button to press, your just like, “Left, because I feel like it”. You feel like it because of this reaction of your brain, but deep thoughts are GENERATED, they don’t just happen because of chance.
And you know this how? This is Neuro Scientists. I think they know how to validate their own expirement about free will. Also, did you not read it all?
“It’s not like you’re a machine. Your brain activity is the physiological substance in which your personality and wishes and desires operate,“
I did read it, I was confused about that part though because they say you have no free will and your actions are dependent on nothing but how a chemical reacts. Anyway, they said at the end “If it is, we haven’t put our finger on it," so even this guy isn’t completely sure even though he’s obviously athiest.
If its all chemical, then is there a special chemical reaction that makes me think specifically of Buu fighting Superman in a certain place, way, pace, etc.? If there is then there must, MUST be infinite chemicals in your brain because theres infinite different things that you could possibly generate. Even the experiment story supports what i’ve said, “Caveats remain, holding open the door for free will. For instance, the experiment may not reflect the mental dynamics of other, more complicated decisions." So, I still find it somewhat impossible for a sense of free will to be absent.
KingBoo wrote:
If its all chemical, then is there a special chemical reaction that makes me think specifically of Buu fighting Superman in a certain place, way, pace, etc.? If there is then there must, MUST be infinite chemicals in your brain because theres infinite different things that you could possibly generate. Even the experiment story supports what i’ve said, “Caveats remain, holding open the door for free will. For instance, the experiment may not reflect the mental dynamics of other, more complicated decisions." So, I still find it somewhat impossible for a sense of free will to be absent.
Okay first of all junior infinity is an impossible feat for the human mind you can’t imagine nor think infinitely.
gabmed wrote:
is theists really a word?
lol just put religious and atheists
Yes, “Theist” is a word, and it refers to someone that believes in a divinity or supernatural higher power. “Religious” also does not always refer to someone that believes in a god. They are not interchangeable words.
KingBoo wrote:
If its all chemical, then is there a special chemical reaction that makes me think specifically of Buu fighting Superman in a certain place, way, pace, etc.? If there is then there must, MUST be infinite chemicals in your brain because theres infinite different things that you could possibly generate. Even the experiment story supports what i’ve said, “Caveats remain, holding open the door for free will. For instance, the experiment may not reflect the mental dynamics of other, more complicated decisions." So, I still find it somewhat impossible for a sense of free will to be absent.
Okay first of all junior infinity is an impossible feat for the human mind you can’t imagine nor think infinitely.
I meant theres infinite things you could possible think of, just like theres infinite different sizes you could think of. You can’t think of it all though, obviously.
Haylias wrote:
Atheist. You don’t need a deity to have a higher purpose by the way, you don’t even need one.
Thats not what i’m trying to get at really
Then re-iterate.
Sorry if this post seems a little thrown out:
I never even said that you need a DIETY for a higher purpose but you definitly can’t if everything is JUST energy and mass randomly coming together once in a while to create organisms that evolve intill they can think(well, you beleive thinking is an illusion).
Haylias wrote:
Atheist. You don’t need a deity to have a higher purpose by the way, you don’t even need one.
Thats not what i’m trying to get at really
Then re-iterate.
Sorry if this post seems a little thrown out:
I never even said that you need a DIETY for a higher purpose but you definitly can’t if everything is JUST energy and mass randomly coming together once in a while to create organisms that evolve intill they can think(well, you beleive thinking is an illusion).
Okay, I gotcha. But why do you need a higher purpose? Does that not seem somewhat arrogant?
Haylias wrote:
Atheist. You don’t need a deity to have a higher purpose by the way, you don’t even need one.
Thats not what i’m trying to get at really
Then re-iterate.
Sorry if this post seems a little thrown out:
I never even said that you need a DIETY for a higher purpose but you definitly can’t if everything is JUST energy and mass randomly coming together once in a while to create organisms that evolve intill they can think(well, you beleive thinking is an illusion).
Okay, I gotcha. But why do you need a higher purpose? Does that not seem somewhat arrogant?
I don’t need one, it’s just awkward to believe reality is so pointless, but this is focused on if free will exists more than anything else, thats the only way to actually prove anything. Free will needs a source to spark the control but people who beleive in just the known laws of the physical world have only one explanation and that is that free will is an illusion and your mind is actually just a series of chemical reactions working your body somehow in a way that you feel like you have control but you don’t. I find that impossible knowing what the mind can do, so I believe in a HIGHER POWER, which could be a diety but not in the sense that its some old guy in a chair or a blue woman with 9 arms, just a force beyond physical comprehenshion that set what exists. We won’t understand it so theres no use arguing about what its purpose is because it IS PURPOSE and... i’m not going to take this too far, you get my point.
Haylias wrote:
Atheist. You don’t need a deity to have a higher purpose by the way, you don’t even need one.
Thats not what i’m trying to get at really
Then re-iterate.
Sorry if this post seems a little thrown out:
I never even said that you need a DIETY for a higher purpose but you definitly can’t if everything is JUST energy and mass randomly coming together once in a while to create organisms that evolve intill they can think(well, you beleive thinking is an illusion).
Okay, I gotcha. But why do you need a higher purpose? Does that not seem somewhat arrogant?
No, it doesn’t.
Giving something purpose is a step in giving something meaning, which is a staple of our species.
So, if someone feels more content in having a purpose, it isn’t arrogance so much as an understanding.
Not to say it can’t somehow lead to arrogance, but there is no causality.
Haylias wrote:
Atheist. You don’t need a deity to have a higher purpose by the way, you don’t even need one.
Thats not what i’m trying to get at really
Then re-iterate.
Sorry if this post seems a little thrown out:
I never even said that you need a DIETY for a higher purpose but you definitly can’t if everything is JUST energy and mass randomly coming together once in a while to create organisms that evolve intill they can think(well, you beleive thinking is an illusion).
Okay, I gotcha. But why do you need a higher purpose? Does that not seem somewhat arrogant?
No, it doesn’t.
Giving something purpose is a step in giving something meaning, which is a staple of our species.
So, if someone feels more content in having a purpose, it isn’t arrogance so much as an understanding.
Not to say it can’t somehow lead to arrogance, but there is no causality.
I was going on the fact that a divine purpose undoubtedly was invented to make humans feel important and of consequence in the Universe. Also it seems arrogant that (christian theology) all non-human animals have no souls and do not ascend to a heaven of some sort. What makes humans far more valuable and more important on a cosmic scale than say, a pig?
Haylias wrote:
Atheist. You don’t need a deity to have a higher purpose by the way, you don’t even need one.
Thats not what i’m trying to get at really
Then re-iterate.
Sorry if this post seems a little thrown out:
I never even said that you need a DIETY for a higher purpose but you definitly can’t if everything is JUST energy and mass randomly coming together once in a while to create organisms that evolve intill they can think(well, you beleive thinking is an illusion).
Okay, I gotcha. But why do you need a higher purpose? Does that not seem somewhat arrogant?
No, it doesn’t.
Giving something purpose is a step in giving something meaning, which is a staple of our species.
So, if someone feels more content in having a purpose, it isn’t arrogance so much as an understanding.
Not to say it can’t somehow lead to arrogance, but there is no causality.
I was going on the fact that a divine purpose undoubtedly was invented to make humans feel important and of consequence in the Universe. Also it seems arrogant that (christian theology) all non-human animals have no souls and do not ascend to a heaven of some sort. What makes humans far more valuable and more important on a cosmic scale than say, a pig?
It sounds as though you’re lumping together all beliefs in deities, higher powers, etc. and fate or “divine purpose” into equaling Christianity.
There a number of religious and spiritual groups outside of Christianity that have beliefs and ideas on these topics.
Unless of course your second sentence wasn’t meant to relate to your first.
--- Sometimes the most beautiful things in life are also the most terrifying.
Haylias wrote:
Atheist. You don’t need a deity to have a higher purpose by the way, you don’t even need one.
Thats not what i’m trying to get at really
Then re-iterate.
Sorry if this post seems a little thrown out:
I never even said that you need a DIETY for a higher purpose but you definitly can’t if everything is JUST energy and mass randomly coming together once in a while to create organisms that evolve intill they can think(well, you beleive thinking is an illusion).
Okay, I gotcha. But why do you need a higher purpose? Does that not seem somewhat arrogant?
No, it doesn’t.
Giving something purpose is a step in giving something meaning, which is a staple of our species.
So, if someone feels more content in having a purpose, it isn’t arrogance so much as an understanding.
Not to say it can’t somehow lead to arrogance, but there is no causality.
I was going on the fact that a divine purpose undoubtedly was invented to make humans feel important and of consequence in the Universe. Also it seems arrogant that (christian theology) all non-human animals have no souls and do not ascend to a heaven of some sort. What makes humans far more valuable and more important on a cosmic scale than say, a pig?
I never said anything about us being more important than animals, even though I do think that, but all I said is that I beleive in God and was supporting this beleif.
Religion 
