This thought process started from a message that MVC members posted, so I have included the message as reference.
I think that this would solve a few issues and as a Moderator of this site, I do hope that people will put some consideration into it.
Brutus Kicks Ass wrote:
firewolf81 wrote:
the21gamer wrote:
I say demotion. Some people are too immature to be a mod.
I agree.
*looks at firewolfs Avy*
Hmmmmmmmmmmm I agree too.
jk
Well, truth be told, if there was ever a major outcry against something I had done and there was a resonable percentage (more people for than against), I would stand down as Moderator.
I do believe that we in part, represent this site and set a example for other members to follow. I think it is an unfair advantage that Moderators can not be banned, demoted, warned officially ect. For some, this gives them a free reign to bend or even break he rules as they see fit without ill consequences that would normally befall a regular member.
Personally, I think that Moderators should have separate Moderator accounts that are well....separate to their regular accounts. This wold make it so they would moderate on the moderator accounts and post normal topics, conversations ect on their regular accounts. This would serve two purposes.
If they break the rules as I have seen happen, they can have their normal account banned. This means all they could do is moderate and not participate in normal conversations till their ban was up, thus holding moderators accountable for their actions.
Secondly, this ties in with the ideal that Golden Raptor himself holds true. Moderators are Members First and Moderators second.
This makes Moderators, who are a secondary function to a normal members actions, a separate entity.
It would solve he issue of a personal PM box being flooded with member complaints about things that need moderating.
It would solve the problem of Moderators not being accountable for their actions.
It wold give th people reassurance that they can talk to a member any way they wish without fearing the moderator rank.
It will also stop moderators having any god complexes as something that is a secondary power is always primarily at their disposal.
It wouldn’t take much, Bjarne would just have to make separate accounts and make them moderator accounts. People can use two MVC accounts on different web browsers, or they could log out and log into their MOD account if needed in the same browser.
it wouldn’t be that difficult.
I just think that as representatives, whether officially or unofficially, we need to be held accountable for our actions and need the ability to be demoted/stripped if we have been a bad member.
because as it stands, and Golden Raptor has said this himself, Certain moderators are Less than desirable members but excellent Moderators
Well seeing as they are one in the same, how does that work. bad members never should have got a moderator position in the first place and if they have fallen form grace, I think its time they had to face the music and become accountable for the actions as a member rather than using the Moderator shield to escape conviction.
I am aware this includes me and I would be more than happy to do this. I have nothing to hide and nothing to gain, I think its only fair for all of MVC if this change happens.
What about having it where mods CAN edit/ban etc other mods?
Essentially the mods would be users but with editing capabilities still, and without the need of a second account.
Ah huh, where lies the problem, no nudity, no explictness just one furry bouncing on another furry....bit hard to have sex if you have all your clothes on now isn’t it.
Tyreaus wrote:
What about having it where mods CAN edit/ban etc other mods?
Essentially the mods would be users but with editing capabilities still, and without the need of a second account.
I thought of that, but then it could lead t a mod war where one moderator out of spite could ban or even perma ban another cause of some petty personal feud.
It could happen and then the site would be left with few or no Mods.
If someone was to turn...'evil' they could ban all the mods and go on a massive spam rampage and delete all the topics with no ill consequence. The chaos that one rogue mod could do...MVC could disapear like Atlantis in one hour, a person could delete every single topic in a hour.....That just gives mods more power...too dangerous.
Tyreaus wrote:
What about having it where mods CAN edit/ban etc other mods?
Essentially the mods would be users but with editing capabilities still, and without the need of a second account.
I thought of that, but then it could lead t a mod war where one moderator out of spite could ban or even perma ban another cause of some petty personal feud.
It could happen and then the site would be left with few or no Mods.
If someone was to turn...'evil' they could ban all the mods and go on a massive spam rampage and delete all the topics with no ill consequence. The chaos that one rogue mod could do...MVC could disapear like Atlantis in one hour, a person could delete every single topic in a hour.....That just gives mods more power...too dangerous.
Well if you had a moderator account and a normal account, and you ban someones normal account then they can just ban your normal account with their moderator account(assuming they are a mod also).
Tyreaus wrote:
What about having it where mods CAN edit/ban etc other mods?
Essentially the mods would be users but with editing capabilities still, and without the need of a second account.
I thought of that, but then it could lead t a mod war where one moderator out of spite could ban or even perma ban another cause of some petty personal feud.
It could happen and then the site would be left with few or no Mods.
If someone was to turn...'evil' they could ban all the mods and go on a massive spam rampage and delete all the topics with no ill consequence. The chaos that one rogue mod could do...MVC could disapear like Atlantis in one hour, a person could delete every single topic in a hour.....That just gives mods more power...too dangerous.
ummm...thats why you make the most trusted mod be the one who is able to ban other mods...
Tyreaus wrote:
What about having it where mods CAN edit/ban etc other mods?
Essentially the mods would be users but with editing capabilities still, and without the need of a second account.
I thought of that, but then it could lead t a mod war where one moderator out of spite could ban or even perma ban another cause of some petty personal feud.
It could happen and then the site would be left with few or no Mods.
If someone was to turn...'evil' they could ban all the mods and go on a massive spam rampage and delete all the topics with no ill consequence. The chaos that one rogue mod could do...MVC could disapear like Atlantis in one hour, a person could delete every single topic in a hour.....That just gives mods more power...too dangerous.
The problem I see is that that is just as possible with a two account system. Unless I’ve read something wrong, which if I have correct me. The imminuty they have as of now prevents that, but doesn’t make them subject to their own laws at the same time.
Unless the ban times were made minimal, say a day at max, but even then the possibility looms.
Theres always a debate over this.. It gets tiring- Everone wants power, everyone wants to be a moderator. I do not see why the world is power hungry.. *sigh*
A moderator should be someone that people trust, are friends with, is not a control freak, level headed and someone who is a “good” person-
--- "Man.. It feels good when alot of losers are around. "
Actually now that I think of it, as it is a mod can still go on a deleting spree with topics and the other mods wouldn’t be able to stop him. This way there’s actually a chance of the person being stopped.
Tyreaus wrote:
What about having it where mods CAN edit/ban etc other mods?
Essentially the mods would be users but with editing capabilities still, and without the need of a second account.
I thought of that, but then it could lead t a mod war where one moderator out of spite could ban or even perma ban another cause of some petty personal feud.
It could happen and then the site would be left with few or no Mods.
If someone was to turn...'evil' they could ban all the mods and go on a massive spam rampage and delete all the topics with no ill consequence. The chaos that one rogue mod could do...MVC could disapear like Atlantis in one hour, a person could delete every single topic in a hour.....That just gives mods more power...too dangerous.
The problem I see is that that is just as possible with a two account system. Unless I’ve read something wrong, which if I have correct me. The imminuty they have as of now prevents that, but doesn’t make them subject to their own laws at the same time.
Unless the ban times were made minimal, say a day at max, but even then the possibility looms.
yes I suppose you are right. Even now that could happen.
A mod can not ban another mod, nor ca they edit another’s post or influence his/her actions.
OH MY..........No matter what, a mod could go crazy and shut down MVC and rid it of its history forever.......O.o
I mean, you could spend the time before it opening up all the topics to the point of deletion and then just click delete one after the other and MVc would disappear forever.
*shudders*
Thats why mods need to be good members, they are one in the same......OH my....this could actually happen.........
Tyreaus wrote:
What about having it where mods CAN edit/ban etc other mods?
Essentially the mods would be users but with editing capabilities still, and without the need of a second account.
I thought of that, but then it could lead t a mod war where one moderator out of spite could ban or even perma ban another cause of some petty personal feud.
It could happen and then the site would be left with few or no Mods.
If someone was to turn...'evil' they could ban all the mods and go on a massive spam rampage and delete all the topics with no ill consequence. The chaos that one rogue mod could do...MVC could disapear like Atlantis in one hour, a person could delete every single topic in a hour.....That just gives mods more power...too dangerous.
The problem I see is that that is just as possible with a two account system. Unless I’ve read something wrong, which if I have correct me. The imminuty they have as of now prevents that, but doesn’t make them subject to their own laws at the same time.
Unless the ban times were made minimal, say a day at max, but even then the possibility looms.
yes I suppose you are right. Even now that could happen.
A mod can not ban another mod, nor ca they edit another’s post or influence his/her actions.
OH MY..........No matter what, a mod could go crazy and shut down MVC and rid it of its history forever.......O.o
I mean, you could spend the time before it opening up all the topics to the point of deletion and then just click delete one after the other and MVc would disappear forever.
*shudders*
Thats why mods need to be good members, they are one in the same......OH my....this could actually happen.........
Although, yes it can happen now, having the moderator accounts subject to other mods makes it more likely for one of the other mods to be able to stop the person going on the rampage. Ontop of that benefit, it gives a better sense of equality, and that the mods would then be subject to the same rules they enforce.
I think more people would be at ease knowing that the mods are subject to their own rules, instead of being immortal albiet to Bjarne.
Tyreaus wrote:
What about having it where mods CAN edit/ban etc other mods?
Essentially the mods would be users but with editing capabilities still, and without the need of a second account.
I thought of that, but then it could lead t a mod war where one moderator out of spite could ban or even perma ban another cause of some petty personal feud.
It could happen and then the site would be left with few or no Mods.
If someone was to turn...'evil' they could ban all the mods and go on a massive spam rampage and delete all the topics with no ill consequence. The chaos that one rogue mod could do...MVC could disapear like Atlantis in one hour, a person could delete every single topic in a hour.....That just gives mods more power...too dangerous.
The problem I see is that that is just as possible with a two account system. Unless I’ve read something wrong, which if I have correct me. The imminuty they have as of now prevents that, but doesn’t make them subject to their own laws at the same time.
Unless the ban times were made minimal, say a day at max, but even then the possibility looms.
yes I suppose you are right. Even now that could happen.
A mod can not ban another mod, nor ca they edit another’s post or influence his/her actions.
OH MY..........No matter what, a mod could go crazy and shut down MVC and rid it of its history forever.......O.o
I mean, you could spend the time before it opening up all the topics to the point of deletion and then just click delete one after the other and MVc would disappear forever.
*shudders*
Thats why mods need to be good members, they are one in the same......OH my....this could actually happen.........
Tyreaus wrote:
What about having it where mods CAN edit/ban etc other mods?
Essentially the mods would be users but with editing capabilities still, and without the need of a second account.
I thought of that, but then it could lead t a mod war where one moderator out of spite could ban or even perma ban another cause of some petty personal feud.
It could happen and then the site would be left with few or no Mods.
If someone was to turn...'evil' they could ban all the mods and go on a massive spam rampage and delete all the topics with no ill consequence. The chaos that one rogue mod could do...MVC could disapear like Atlantis in one hour, a person could delete every single topic in a hour.....That just gives mods more power...too dangerous.
The problem I see is that that is just as possible with a two account system. Unless I’ve read something wrong, which if I have correct me. The imminuty they have as of now prevents that, but doesn’t make them subject to their own laws at the same time.
Unless the ban times were made minimal, say a day at max, but even then the possibility looms.
yes I suppose you are right. Even now that could happen.
A mod can not ban another mod, nor ca they edit another’s post or influence his/her actions.
OH MY..........No matter what, a mod could go crazy and shut down MVC and rid it of its history forever.......O.o
I mean, you could spend the time before it opening up all the topics to the point of deletion and then just click delete one after the other and MVc would disappear forever.
*shudders*
Thats why mods need to be good members, they are one in the same......OH my....this could actually happen.........
Although, yes it can happen now, having the moderator accounts subject to other mods makes it more likely for one of the other mods to be able to stop the person going on the rampage. Ontop of that benefit, it gives a better sense of equality, and that the mods would then be subject to the same rules they enforce.
I think more people would be at ease knowing that the mods are subject to their own rules, instead of being immortal albiet to Bjarne.
It still opens up the possibility that another mod could ban the other mods before he/she did it, ergo rendering them helpless to do anything, even a 24 hr ban for all but one mod would buy them enough time to wreck havoc. However, I do see the point in it would hold us accountable for our actions and it wouldn’t make the possibility of a lone mode going nuts any greater or lesser as we still are powerless to stop them as it stands now.
Tyreaus wrote:
What about having it where mods CAN edit/ban etc other mods?
Essentially the mods would be users but with editing capabilities still, and without the need of a second account.
I thought of that, but then it could lead t a mod war where one moderator out of spite could ban or even perma ban another cause of some petty personal feud.
It could happen and then the site would be left with few or no Mods.
If someone was to turn...'evil' they could ban all the mods and go on a massive spam rampage and delete all the topics with no ill consequence. The chaos that one rogue mod could do...MVC could disapear like Atlantis in one hour, a person could delete every single topic in a hour.....That just gives mods more power...too dangerous.
The problem I see is that that is just as possible with a two account system. Unless I’ve read something wrong, which if I have correct me. The imminuty they have as of now prevents that, but doesn’t make them subject to their own laws at the same time.
Unless the ban times were made minimal, say a day at max, but even then the possibility looms.
yes I suppose you are right. Even now that could happen.
A mod can not ban another mod, nor ca they edit another’s post or influence his/her actions.
OH MY..........No matter what, a mod could go crazy and shut down MVC and rid it of its history forever.......O.o
I mean, you could spend the time before it opening up all the topics to the point of deletion and then just click delete one after the other and MVc would disappear forever.
*shudders*
Thats why mods need to be good members, they are one in the same......OH my....this could actually happen.........
do it wolfy!
No, I somehow think that that’s exactly what we’re trying to avoid. lol.
---
Remember: Kindness is not a characteristic. It is a skill. A skill which improves with practice.
Tyreaus wrote:
What about having it where mods CAN edit/ban etc other mods?
Essentially the mods would be users but with editing capabilities still, and without the need of a second account.
I thought of that, but then it could lead t a mod war where one moderator out of spite could ban or even perma ban another cause of some petty personal feud.
It could happen and then the site would be left with few or no Mods.
If someone was to turn...'evil' they could ban all the mods and go on a massive spam rampage and delete all the topics with no ill consequence. The chaos that one rogue mod could do...MVC could disapear like Atlantis in one hour, a person could delete every single topic in a hour.....That just gives mods more power...too dangerous.
The problem I see is that that is just as possible with a two account system. Unless I’ve read something wrong, which if I have correct me. The imminuty they have as of now prevents that, but doesn’t make them subject to their own laws at the same time.
Unless the ban times were made minimal, say a day at max, but even then the possibility looms.
yes I suppose you are right. Even now that could happen.
A mod can not ban another mod, nor ca they edit another’s post or influence his/her actions.
OH MY..........No matter what, a mod could go crazy and shut down MVC and rid it of its history forever.......O.o
I mean, you could spend the time before it opening up all the topics to the point of deletion and then just click delete one after the other and MVc would disappear forever.
*shudders*
Thats why mods need to be good members, they are one in the same......OH my....this could actually happen.........
Although, yes it can happen now, having the moderator accounts subject to other mods makes it more likely for one of the other mods to be able to stop the person going on the rampage. Ontop of that benefit, it gives a better sense of equality, and that the mods would then be subject to the same rules they enforce.
I think more people would be at ease knowing that the mods are subject to their own rules, instead of being immortal albiet to Bjarne.
It still opens up the possibility that another mod could ban the other mods before he/she did it, ergo rendering them helpless to do anything, even a 24 hr ban for all but one mod would buy them enough time to wreck havoc. However, I do see the point in it would hold us accountable for our actions and it wouldn’t make the possibility of a lone mode going nuts any greater or lesser as we still are powerless to stop them as it stands now.
Exactly. Either way it stands a large problem. Perhaps a log of bans that runs through the report system as well? (so if a mod is banned the others can find out and stop it before hand)
Maybe a ban undo-button would work too (not for oneself but for others). Actually an undo button for a lot of things would be helpful, like locked threads and the likes.
I don’t think that allowing us to ban one another is such a good idea. However, having an account dedicated to moderating and another dedicated to posting seems intriguing. However I’m not too fond of having to either go with two browsers or log out.
I think this could all be solved much more simply. Amongst ourselves and without forcing Bjarne to implement some kind of weird thing just because of a feud. I know what this entire situation is about, and I suppose that if you’re against him for his “immaturity” then you should call a moderator meeting to discuss it openly with him.
All we need is a demotion and no more kids as moderators.
SA-X is/was a good mod and he’s not over 17. (though he isn’t on as often anymore)
I don’t think age always has so much to do with moderating abilities, maturity yes.
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